Kentuckywrestling.com HS Rankings 2016/2017 - JANUARY 3

[Ranger123 43]

Finally settling down after all of the holiday chaos; Dutch and I powered through 5+ hours last night of track research and made some good updates.  A major item to note.  We have dropped a few kids this edition.  In the previous post, we removed kids who we did not see a fat test for.  This time we have removed kids who have not competed (or only 1-2 matches) unless we know it is a special circumstance and we have information on when the kid will return to action.  If coaches are not keeping track up to date there isn't much we can do about that.

 

Teams - at this point Union is starting to pull away from the field a bit, with a super tight pack from 2-4 and 5 not far behind.  With Union sending virtually the entire lineup to Lexington they will be hard to beat.  But I do see the battle for a team trophy being pretty exciting after that with finals matches and bonus points potentially deciding the final order.

 

Not much movement at the top of each weight with the following exceptions:

- Daniel Knight finally makes 108 and will be a top contender

- Miller edges Bender in WCI finals

- Castellano returns to action and should be one of the top 132s

- the movement between 145 & 152 is a mess

- it sounds like Johnson Central lineup will shift down, but who knows

- 220 keeps losing top end kids

Now that we should be able to get into a better routine, we will try to update every week to 10 days.

Rankings_16_17_0103.pdf

[ukpridewrestler11 276]

Trinity is down this year. Not used to seeing them ranked that low.

[385 109]

Steven Brown (Doss, 4th at 220) plans to wrestle 195 from this point forward. 

[DrBaker 497]

The cream has risen to to top. Season gets more and more exciting!

 

 

[FalconWrestling 147]

1 hour ago, ukpridewrestler11 said:

Trinity is down this year. Not used to seeing them ranked that low.

It's a surprisingly down year for them. Interested to see how they bounce back in the next couple years. It is hard to recover losing a trio like Heidorf, Barton, and Frankrone

[Eat at Joe's 29]

1 minute ago, FalconWrestling said:

It's a surprisingly down year for them. Interested to see how they bounce back in the next couple years. It is hard to recover losing a trio like Heidorf, Barton, and Frankrone

Think you mean quad  - Duncan

[Nike Man 292]

 How does Walton Verona and Madison Central jump over Woodford in the dual rankings? 

[CradleKY 132]

12 hours ago, Nike Man said:

 How does Walton Verona and Madison Central jump over Woodford in the dual rankings? 

 

Woodford has no upper weights besides Max/Varble.  I think they even forfeit a class or two.  Lost a dual to Larue and it wasn't even close.  Still a contender for top 3 at state tourney because their lower weights are so good. But I'm not sure they'll make up too much of a difference when Tylan Tucker returns because his replacements have been winning matches (even won WCI).  I think Woodford was a little overrated pre season and now are closer to their actual dual/indiv. ranking.  Need to get more big guys to come out for wrestling if they ever want to get back to winning state team titles, Coach Parks certainly has the lower weights he needs to win big.

[Ranger123 43]

13 hours ago, Nike Man said:

 How does Walton Verona and Madison Central jump over Woodford in the dual rankings? 

I actually didn't even notice that before posting. BUT, Just like the team rankings for individual state, the dual team rankings are formula driven. So as kids' rankings adjust, the projected dual scores adjust. For example, if a kid drop from #8 to #20 instead of giving up a major to the #2 kid the formula assumes he will get pinned. I'm not sure what drove that change in the dual rankings, but I will say those 3 appear to be very very close (essentially a tie in the formula). 

[Nike Man 292]

CradleKY, you make some very good points. Woodford does need bigs for sure. Tucker's "replacement" has been solid. The Larue dual was actually pretty close and I believe Woodford was forfeiting 2 or 3 weights that night. Not taking anything away from Larue, I believe that their coaching staff is bringing them back to their winning ways. 

Ranger, I didn't realize that the dual rankings were formula based. I assumed head to head dual results were the driving force. The Madison Central vs Woodford duals have been pretty close with Woodford winning both times. Definitely going to be a fun last few weeks of the season. 

[opinional_start 3]

Kind of curious, how can you rank, Alex Thompson (South Oldham) and  Malik Cunningham (Trigg) above two individuals they just finished behind at the Christian County Tournament on 30 Dec? 

[john cena 0]

how can you put larue county below john hardin? they placed higher than them at WCI, and they beat every team that faced john hardin at the Oldham county super duals?

[grappler-of-old 44]

Geesh people.   There is a rhyme and reason for Ranger's Rankings.  

 

If it is individual rankings you are concerned about you need to look at the entire season of every individual.  One win or loss may not move a person up or down. 

If it is a team ranking.  This is what he believes they will place at state.  One big dog (state champion) may score more points at a state tourney they all of another team.  Even if that other team beat them in a dual or a smaller tourney.  

If you have things to add, such as wins against or losses against.  (Most people forget about the losses) then post them, but please give all the info.  Not "Hey he beat so and so at the so ans so tourney" and forget to mention the losses that person may have against others. 

[CradleKY 132]

2 hours ago, Nike Man said:

CradleKY, you make some very good points. Woodford does need bigs for sure. Tucker's "replacement" has been solid. The Larue dual was actually pretty close and I believe Woodford was forfeiting 2 or 3 weights that night. Not taking anything away from Larue, I believe that their coaching staff is bringing them back to their winning ways. 

Ranger, I didn't realize that the dual rankings were formula based. I assumed head to head dual results were the driving force. The Madison Central vs Woodford duals have been pretty close with Woodford winning both times. Definitely going to be a fun last few weeks of the season. 

 

Larue won 48-36 over Woodford and then lost the next week to Simon Kenton 48-33 and later in the season beat Meade and Wayne Co by smaller margins than they beat Woodford.  I know the transitive property doesn't work on comparing dual teams but just adding context.  

[El Pollo Loco 20]

If I may add something here, dual and tournament standings are two different things. In a dual format, you have to wrestle the team and coach in front of you. I have heard a lot of people say "so and so was missing" "things would be different" but what it comes down to is you wrestle the team in front of you. If a team fills their roster with decent to really good kids, that beats a half team of really good kids. Also it's about match-ups, a coach may bump up or down to get those match-ups that are favorable. A good tournament team, ie: Hoptown of the 90's can have 5-6 really good kids and make some noise at state. A good dual team, is usually a full roster with solid kids at almost every weight, ie: LaRue of late 90's to 2010's. Everyone is correct above, that's the exciting thing about duals anything can happen.

Ranger I think you do a good job doing these rankings, you are very knowledgeable about this and do predict well come state. But ultimately this is forum board and people should lighten up about rankings. Rankings never gave anyone a medal at state tournament.  

[rjs4470 103]

1 hour ago, opinional_start said:

Kind of curious, how can you rank, Alex Thompson (South Oldham) and  Malik Cunningham (Trigg) above two individuals they just finished behind at the Christian County Tournament on 30 Dec? 

Did those two wrestle the wrestlers ranked ahead of them??  Tournament finish, isn't nearly as important as head to head, common opponent, etc.  it's about a body of work, rather than where you finish in one tourney.

[NatureBoy 117]

WOODFORD LOSES TO LARUE, LARUE LOSES TO SK, AND IN A HUGE TOURNEY WV EDGES OUT SK ,DIFFERENT FORMATS BUT IT'S NOT A HUGE LEAP OF FAITH TO THINK WV WOULD GET THE NOD OVER WOODFORD .just saying .On another note they both probably have forfeits at some weights .Like to see Andreoni and Cornett wrestle and before someone's ....get in a bunch I know Cornett beat him in freestyle or something it just seems to be the big match up .Not that I'm saying all the big possible lightweight matchups remind me of a rooster fight or anything jk.

[opinional_start 3]

6 hours ago, rjs4470 said:

Did those two wrestle the wrestlers ranked ahead of them??  Tournament finish, isn't nearly as important as head to head, common opponent, etc.  it's about a body of work, rather than where you finish in one tourney.

That is why I mentioned it. if they had not wrestled then I get it but when a guy has a win over you then it is rather obvious. 

[Ranger123 43]

12 hours ago, opinional_start said:

Kind of curious, how can you rank, Alex Thompson (South Oldham) and  Malik Cunningham (Trigg) above two individuals they just finished behind at the Christian County Tournament on 30 Dec? 

Well first off all we had for results from that event were the placers that were listed; no brackets. So unless you expected us to become Jedis and use the force I have little idea who beat who at that event. Once coaches get track updated we have a better idea, but still not like seeing how the bracket played out. Second, as has been mentioned you can't ignore losses. Yes it is nice to focus on the big wins over a higher ranked kid, but that doesn't cancel out losses to lower ranked kids. 

[opinional_start 3]

4 hours ago, Ranger123 said:

Well first off all we had for results from that event were the placers that were listed; no brackets. So unless you expected us to become Jedis and use the force I have little idea who beat who at that event. Once coaches get track updated we have a better idea, but still not like seeing how the bracket played out. Second, as has been mentioned you can't ignore losses. Yes it is nice to focus on the big wins over a higher ranked kid, but that doesn't cancel out losses to lower ranked kids. 

Well rankings really do not mean much until the state tournament is over. I am guessing you will have the results then to complete. 

[DevilDad 8]

For those that aren't happy with Ranger's rankings, remember, he does this for us - without accepting any compensation and to create chatter. It's not a personal attack. The rankings should inspire our kids, not upset them. If you feel your kid isn't ranked high enough keep it under your hat. They know if they're ranked and it has to be up to them to work hard and improve. Thank God wrestling doesn't hand out participation ribbons!!!

Thank you,  Ranger, for your time and effort. Can't wait to see who was underestimated this February and where the upsets occur!

[rjs4470 103]

31 minutes ago, DevilDad said:

For those that aren't happy with Ranger's rankings, remember, he does this for us - without accepting any compensation and to create chatter. It's not a personal attack. The rankings should inspire our kids, not upset them. If you feel your kid isn't ranked high enough keep it under your hat. They know if they're ranked and it has to be up to them to work hard and improve. Thank God wrestling doesn't hand out participation ribbons!!!

Thank you,  Ranger, for your time and effort. Can't wait to see who was underestimated this February and where the upsets occur!

Yep.  And if you go back and look at past results, usually his rankings end up close to spot on.  Sure a few kids sometimes outwrestle their ranking, but these rankings usually get a lot more right, than wrong.

[REscalera 189]

11 hours ago, Ranger123 said:

Well first off all we had for results from that event were the placers that were listed; no brackets. So unless you expected us to become Jedis and use the force I have little idea who beat who at that event. Once coaches get track updated we have a better idea, but still not like seeing how the bracket played out. Second, as has been mentioned you can't ignore losses. Yes it is nice to focus on the big wins over a higher ranked kid, but that doesn't cancel out losses to lower ranked kids. 

I believe the plural form of Jedi is Jedi. 

[Nike Man 292]

 ^^^That guy!

[NatureBoy 117]

There you have it Ranger is a Sith anyway not a Jedi Ranger and Dutch just like the Emperor and Vader .