Any one else get robed @Fern Creek this weekend?

[UniPeck 15]

This belt series event 50 total kids from bantam to junior. Kids giving up 10-15 pounds and going up in age groups just to get an opportunity to wrestle someone. Two styles at $15 a rip Ouch! I know the weather has done a number on this series. Just seems like a money grab IMO. Now the Lindsey leg of the belt series will be thin because it's the same weekend as OTC...heard it might not be on at Lindsey anyways. This is the kind of stuff that ruins parental support. Understand your selling value tournament directors, did those kids get real value for their money...or their parent's money?

[385 109]

This belt series event 50 total kids from bantam to junior. Kids giving up 10-15 pounds and going up in age groups just to get an opportunity to wrestle someone. Two styles at $15 a rip Ouch! I know the weather has done a number on this series. Just seems like a money grab IMO. Now the Lindsey leg of the belt series will be thin because it's the same weekend as OTC...heard it might not be on at Lindsey anyways. This is the kind of stuff that ruins parental support. Understand your selling value tournament directors, did those kids get real value for their money...or their parent's money?

 

What do you want the directors to do? MAKE kids sign up? This seems like a bit of moaning to me. who cares about going up or down in weight a bit? Just wrestle...

[UniPeck 15]

Moaning? They did wrestle. I am talking about Value, you apologist. Why as a parent would you want to drag you and your kid(s) 60 miles or more for no matches at you age or weight? Shouldn't have charged full price for both.

[rjs4470 103]

This belt series event 50 total kids from bantam to junior. Kids giving up 10-15 pounds and going up in age groups just to get an opportunity to wrestle someone. Two styles at $15 a rip Ouch! I know the weather has done a number on this series. Just seems like a money grab IMO. Now the Lindsey leg of the belt series will be thin because it's the same weekend as OTC...heard it might not be on at Lindsey anyways. This is the kind of stuff that ruins parental support. Understand your selling value tournament directors, did those kids get real value for their money...or their parent's money?

It seems as if participation is dropping every year for the belt series.  I don't really have an issue with the cost, but based on my experience with the series the last two years, we've made the decision not to attend.  A couple of matches in a 5 man bracket or a 3 man round robin doesn't interest my son.  We'd rather travel to a camp, or practice.  

 

That being said, I'm not sure what needs to be done to get interest up instate in the offseason.  I think some of it has do with many of our elite wrestlers going to larger national/regional events (which really they should) is part of it.  The Belt series is a great idea, but for whatever reason kids don't seem to want to do it.  

[UniPeck 15]

There needs to be three established spring tournaments that the series can latch onto, not the other way around. Some venues/clubs have gotten opportunities to host that have no business running a tournament. Also some venues/clubs have five tournaments a season. I wish a Lexington school would step up and take on one of those legs...Coach Teater.

[Ranger123 43]

I think you hit the nail on the head Coach. Our top kids are training for and traveling to national events in the spring. So that impacts the number of those kids who participate in these type of local events. Coach Brown and I put some effort into coordinating MS Team Ky practices with local events to get those kids involved but weather and schedule changes messed that up.

If we are counting on the mid level and starter kids to support these events I think it will always be disappointing.

[385 109]

Moaning? They did wrestle. I am talking about Value, you apologist. Why as a parent would you want to drag you and your kid(s) 60 miles or more for no matches at you age or weight? Shouldn't have charged full price for both.

Lol "apologist"... as mentioned above kids are competing NATIONALLY. If you cant afford $15 per style then I dont know what to tell you. Im fairly certain that 99% of of wrestlers, wrestling families, and coaches have been in this situation, where a tournament just isnt stacked. But you're the only one that took to a public forum to seek retribution. If you want to wrestle matches you should have put your kids on a bus to Indiana Pennsylvania and sent them to FloNationals. But Im guessing you couldnt afford that either...

[rjs4470 103]

As Ranger said, these in state events will continue to have small turnout.  The top high school kids were at Flo, top middle school kids had just returned from a super tough event the previous weekend in Danville.  All that's left to attend are mid level, beginner and youth kids, which more than likely have moved on to other sports.  My son did the entire belt series 2 years ago as a middle schooler.  Even then he only got about 7 or 8 matches in the three events, with half of them against one kid.  So I don't think these events have ever really been well attended, especially at the Cadet level and above and even then, the top kids would just show up here and there.  

[bulldog-leader 56]

Lol "apologist"... as mentioned above kids are competing NATIONALLY. If you cant afford $15 per style then I dont know what to tell you. Im fairly certain that 99% of of wrestlers, wrestling families, and coaches have been in this situation, where a tournament just isnt stacked. But you're the only one that took to a public forum to seek retribution. If you want to wrestle matches you should have put your kids on a bus to Indiana Pennsylvania and sent them to FloNationals. But Im guessing you couldnt afford that either...

385 if you don't think that cost is an issue for many kids I think  you are wrong.  Maybe not the $15-$30 for tourney entry, but travel and food costs also add into it.  

 

I'm not talking about those wrestling families that sacrifice all so that little johnny can wrestle.  I'm talking about kids who have no support from home and have little income in the first place.  There are a lot more than you think out there in this situation.  Wrestling is expensive and time consuming.  Yes if you look hard enough you can find it, but we are talking about kids who can't or don't know how to look for help elsewhere.  

 

I don't know the answer but I know charging $30 for 2-3 matches is not the answer. 

[luvswrestling55 0]

Whew-lots of negativity about this subject.   I have had wrestlers attend the Belt series over the past 3 years also.  Let's be honest. Brackets are usually very small; and the competition is normally not top notch, more beginner and/or novice levels.  But it is local, centrally located for most everyone, completed in one day, very cheap in comparison to Major competitions, and there are no major multiple day expenses for hotels/food/gas.  Out of state teams, primarily from Indiana and Ohio, have also made the journey and based on what I saw this year, whooped up on some of our Ky boys.  So the competition is there and worth coming for.  Yeah your kid may have to move up-so what-it's about the competition opportunity.  No one should be that concerned about wrestling a particular weight at a local tournament in the off season.  Kids cut weight enough during the regular season.  Maybe someone needs to take a look at the timing of these events and consider scheduling them at a later date to increase attendence.  I do think we need to do a better job of giving kids a little more time to recover between matches.  Honestly; I am just glad that there are coaches and volunteers and for that matter volunteer refs to help promote these competitions; especially for the less experienced kids and the kids without the funds to travel long distances to compete.   Thanks for all that you do to promote wrestling.  

[coyotewrestlingclub 0]

We traveled from Tennessee to our first belt series tournament two years ago. I brought 5 very talented wrestlers with me and only two of them won their bracket, and all of them had some tough matches. Due to other commitments we could not attend the other two tournaments that year. We decided to try it again last season. I only brought two wrestlers to the first tournament and again one (my son) won his bracket with some ok competition but pinned his way through, the other kid was matched with some very tough competition. He had Caleb from christian co. and dezember from union?  My son went to the next two tournaments and ended up winning the belt but the talent   dropped off severally with each tournament . We decided not to travel to them this year.

[385 109]

385 if you don't think that cost is an issue for many kids I think  you are wrong.  Maybe not the $15-$30 for tourney entry, but travel and food costs also add into it.  

 

I'm not talking about those wrestling families that sacrifice all so that little johnny can wrestle.  I'm talking about kids who have no support from home and have little income in the first place.  There are a lot more than you think out there in this situation.  Wrestling is expensive and time consuming.  Yes if you look hard enough you can find it, but we are talking about kids who can't or don't know how to look for help elsewhere.  

 

I don't know the answer but I know charging $30 for 2-3 matches is not the answer. 

Trust me I know. I was one of those kids that had no money. However my team had a great network of wrestling moms and dads that helped me out moreso than I could ever repay them for. My point is when I was able to get to a tournament or camp I never took to a forum to air my grievances. And by the way I've never had a referee refuse to ref an exhibition match. The matches can be found if you want them...

[UniPeck 15]

Where should this discussion take place? On a wrestling forum? O wait that's where we are. Hey just cause you don't like the topic doesn't make it valid. Just the simple fact that this many people have brought their issues with the situation to the air in less than 24hrs makes this venue the place to have these types of discussions. I haven't even gotten into the fact that if you show up to every tournament and wrestle 4 times and pin every opponent and some other kid wrestles 5 times in one tournament pins 4 and Dec the last one. And he is in your age group he gets the belt.

[rjs4470 103]

Whew-lots of negativity about this subject.   I have had wrestlers attend the Belt series over the past 3 years also.  Let's be honest. Brackets are usually very small; and the competition is normally not top notch, more beginner and/or novice levels.  But it is local, centrally located for most everyone, completed in one day, very cheap in comparison to Major competitions, and there are no major multiple day expenses for hotels/food/gas.  Out of state teams, primarily from Indiana and Ohio, have also made the journey and based on what I saw this year, whooped up on some of our Ky boys.  So the competition is there and worth coming for.  Yeah your kid may have to move up-so what-it's about the competition opportunity.  No one should be that concerned about wrestling a particular weight at a local tournament in the off season.  Kids cut weight enough during the regular season.  Maybe someone needs to take a look at the timing of these events and consider scheduling them at a later date to increase attendence.  I do think we need to do a better job of giving kids a little more time to recover between matches.  Honestly; I am just glad that there are coaches and volunteers and for that matter volunteer refs to help promote these competitions; especially for the less experienced kids and the kids without the funds to travel long distances to compete.   Thanks for all that you do to promote wrestling.  

I don't know that moving dates would improve attendance.  In the past, the participation dropped with each successive tourney, with the last typically being 2 or 3 man round robins, lots of combined weight classes/divisions, etc.  Most of the tournaments scheduled for later in the spring for the most part have been cancelled and i don't see that pushing the series back would change that trend.  The further you get away from the season, the tougher it gets to attract wrestlers.  And I don't know of any way to fix that problem.  If the event is not attractive to the top/elite wrestlers....the guys who do work at the sport year round they just aren't going to come.  And I don't know how you make these tournaments attractive to not only our in-state guys, but also draw out of state wrestlers.  Until these events can consistently draw top kids both in and out of state, the attendance will continue to be dismal.  

[385 109]

Where should this discussion take place? On a wrestling forum? O wait that's where we are. Hey just cause you don't like the topic doesn't make it valid. Just the simple fact that this many people have brought their issues with the situation to the air in less than 24hrs makes this venue the place to have these types of discussions. I haven't even gotten into the fact that if you show up to every tournament and wrestle 4 times and pin every opponent and some other kid wrestles 5 times in one tournament pins 4 and Dec the last one. And he is in your age group he gets the belt.

Or you could be a man and speak face to face with the director of the tournaments? How about trying to help fix the problem and think of a solution rather than just complaining on the Internet lol.

[UniPeck 15]

Be a man? Maybe this hits a little close to home?

[385 109]

Not at all lol I just know some of the coaches at FC and they're all very hard working people. Who do most everything for free or next to nothing. Any money they make goes to the program. It's not fair to them for you to try to run them through the dirt. They may actually have very little to do with the administration of the tournament since it is a "series" but the title of this thready is degrading to Fern Creek Wrestling.

I won't comment back on this thread because I'm not going to entertain a name calling fight on the Internet with an anonymous adult.

[UniPeck 15]

The Names Jon Askelson and name calling? They didn't have to take the money...for even a kid who did get a match in ether style.

[kdsmith27 14]

I personally find it disappointing that most all of the off season School/clubs or open mat clubs do not attend. I know they are out there. We have done full circle as far as off season participation. We have clubs every where in the State that now have post season clubs or open mats. Coaches asked to add more styles to the series, so we did. Each tournament emphasizes a style such as Freestyle/folkstyle, than, this weekend will be Folkstyle/Greco, and will finish with Folkstyle at Central Hardin that would have been first if not for the snow.  Even though it is a belt series, each tournament also offers a medal for placement. What a better place to learn a new style, get mat time, hang out with friends and have some fun with a new style.

 

I have not heard one parent after his or her kid has wrestler Freestyle say they did not enjoy learning it and also wrestling it. Most say they are surprised that they do. But will let them do more of it.

 

To all the coaches with clubs and open mat teams , The opportunity is there for them to gain experience off season with live wrestling situations learning new styles that will help them with folkstyle during the season.

 

I can honestly say that every kid that has wrestled in all the styles, are the kids that continuously place at our High School State tournament and nationally winning an AA status.

[@controlwa 13]

As a coach of a public school that has an extremely low SES (social economic status) population in it this is the hardest thing to get around. What I have done to change this and have high success with it. BUT before I say this I claim 2x more on my taxes each year than I make coaching. So seeing as that none of my kids would wrestle in the off season I created a Gatorade system, where I take ($2 donations) for Gatorade, save all the money throughout the year and that pays for all of my kids USA cards and most of the events. This topic was not a cut on Fern Creek what so ever but to answer the question on $$$ being dropped because of attendance it will never happen because the refs must be paid. Any tournament director will tell you refs are the reason why you lose money at tournaments is because of ref cost. Can't knock them, they have to get paid. 

 

We do not attend any Kentucky off season tournaments any longer because of attendance at them sadly enough. Reason being if I'm telling my kids all year to wrestle year round but then drive 2 hours to have them wrestle the same guy twice it's hard to keep the interest going if they see no one else wrestling. We wrestle in IN 4-5 x per summer and the biggest difference is numbers 200+ schools with wrestling with at least 60% with feeder programs. So only time will help and continuing to build programs.

 

My suggestion is that only have the events for youth/ms programs seeing as that they are the only ones come and more clubs to host FREE Fight nights for HS guys and offer incentives for coming I buy fight shorts or there spirit wear for the next season for my guys if they attend 15 workouts and 5 events. Yes I should not have to do this but in our case with our school district you have no automatic feeder to your HS, and yes it's in a great neighborhood but no the neighborhood kids do not go here! So I'm usually trying to convince freshmen to work as hard as possible you have to find ways around it and yes that was my rant. 

 

Please feel free to add to the ideas on what you do to get the kids wrestle in the off season, and no I will not respond to any disagreements with my post. Because I'm only post or care about promoting the sport in KY, and I support the events and will go back to them. But I have my kids for 3 years at most I can't afford to not have them have wasted mat time. I myself along with other coaches have given up on inviting others to our open mats because no one comes but at every open mat I have 3-4 older state placers with college experience at them. However if we continue to do the same thing every summer how are we growing speaking of events? I think it's great that there are more clubs with excellent coaches coaching them and taking them to national level tournaments but not everyone has access to those coaches or facilities.

 

I may have gotten off topic a little and this may be the wrong thread for this part but this needs to be discussed, because every time I come to this site I'm hopeful to see something positive on this site. But instead all I see is complaints, just because you are not a head coach or a coach if you care DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT. Even if it is small I understand about time, kids, and work. And thank you to the ones that promote this sport, USA wrestling and site. I do not have all the answers and I may be wrong, and this is my first and last rant on this site. Because unlike most I do not keep doing the same things that are not working and expect the same result because I already feel like I've wasted an hour of my time so please prove me wrong. 

[kdsmith27 14]

I can tell you for a fact that officials in the off season if they get paid, but not always get $50. it pretty much covers there gas. Just saying! schools that host these tournaments do make a little money for their program. A lot less with a poor turnout. KY USAW makes nothing from these tournaments and most times will help with tournament expenses with poor attendance. Most of us that work to put on these tournament, do it for the kids to get mat time and more experience in the styles. I'm sorry that you feel the way you do and can only say that your kids are missing a good time and mini clinics given at most tournaments. Lindsey Wilson had low attendance, but i don't think anyone that attended would say that they did not have a good time and lots of mat time and clinics.  

 

By the way, most of us are or were public school coaches. Getting paid my stipend at the end of the season  only reimbursed some of my expenses. We all put a lot of our own $$ to help our team during the season and even off season.

[UniPeck 15]

Lindsey should be commended for their tourney. $15 for both styles and two clinics. Not to mention signed posters and such. What a great model to follow in case anyone is paying attention.

Again fine job Lindsey for doing the right thing and providing VALUE for our wrestlers and their families.