kentucky needs to step it up

[Keepyourheadup 10]

I think a lot of people have made some great suggestions. I think at last youth meeting they came up with the idea to take all the placers and put together a tournament after the state tournament. That should put to rest who the real state champion is. I went to two youth practices recently and talked to multiple kids. I asked them if they were going to win a title. Most of their faces lit up and the response was "yes". The point is that an 8 year kid is excited to win the tournament. Regardless if the adults are arguing that it is not a true state title. I say let them be kids and be excited to win a title.

As far as weight classes I think this will be addressed at the new season ending tournament. The big problem is the parents cutting little Johnny down from 54 to 50lbs when the kid is 8 years old. That's a problem. I remember doing regional weigh ins a few years ago and a parent told me his 7 year old stayed home from school and ran all day prior to weigh ins. Wow. I thought what is wrong with people.

I can say as a parent and coach I can remember when my son won his first youth title. The excitement for him was indescribable. He ended up winning 3 total and none of the compared to the first. Now that he is in middle school he understands what it takes just to make it to state. The point is that in the moment of his first title he didn't get his medal and say "I'm not the true champion". They have plenty of time to work and battle to make it to state and hopefully win a middle school title or high school title. Let them be kids. I can tell you it gets tougher the older they get. That so called title might be the only one they ever get. Mine is still hoping to get a middle school title. Maybe one day he will. Lol.

Good luck to all the youth kids Sunday. When all the kids climb up on that podium to get their medal look at their faces. Let me know if the kids care they are not the "true state champion"

[Keepyourheadup 10]

I think a lot of people have made some great suggestions. I think at last youth meeting they came up with the idea to take all the placers and put together a tournament after the state tournament. That should put to rest who the real state champion is. I went to two youth practices recently and talked to multiple kids. I asked them if they were going to win a title. Most of their faces lit up and the response was "yes". The point is that an 8 year kid is excited to win the tournament. Regardless if the adults are arguing that it is not a true state title. I say let them be kids and be excited to win a title.

As far as weight classes I think this will be addressed at the new season ending tournament. The big problem is the parents cutting little Johnny down from 54 to 50lbs when the kid is 8 years old. That's a problem. I remember doing regional weigh ins a few years ago and a parent told me his 7 year old stayed home from school and ran all day prior to weigh ins. Wow. I thought what is wrong with people.

I can say as a parent and coach I can remember when my son won his first youth title. The excitement for him was indescribable. He ended up winning 3 total and none of the compared to the first. Now that he is in middle school he understands what it takes just to make it to state. The point is that in the moment of his first title he didn't get his medal and say "I'm not the true champion". They have plenty of time to work and battle to make it to state and hopefully win a middle school title or high school title. Let them be kids. I can tell you it gets tougher the older they get. That so called title might be the only one they ever get. Mine is still hoping to get a middle school title. Maybe one day he will. Lol.

Good luck to all the youth kids Sunday. When all the kids climb up on that podium to get their medal look at their faces. Let me know if the kids care they are not the "true state champion"

I think a lot of people have made some great suggestions. I think at last youth meeting they came up with the idea to take all the placers and put together a tournament after the state tournament. That should put to rest who the real state champion is. I went to two youth practices recently and talked to multiple kids. I asked them if they were going to win a title. Most of their faces lit up and the response was "yes". The point is that an 8 year kid is excited to win the tournament. Regardless if the adults are arguing that it is not a true state title. I say let them be kids and be excited to win a title.

As far as weight classes I think this will be addressed at the new season ending tournament. The big problem is the parents cutting little Johnny down from 54 to 50lbs when the kid is 8 years old. That's a problem. I remember doing regional weigh ins a few years ago and a parent told me his 7 year old stayed home from school and ran all day prior to weigh ins. Wow. I thought what is wrong with people.

I can say as a parent and coach I can remember when my son won his first youth title. The excitement for him was indescribable. He ended up winning 3 total and none of the compared to the first. Now that he is in middle school he understands what it takes just to make it to state. The point is that in the moment of his first title he didn't get his medal and say "I'm not the true champion". They have plenty of time to work and battle to make it to state and hopefully win a middle school title or high school title. Let them be kids. I can tell you it gets tougher the older they get. That so called title might be the only one they ever get. Mine is still hoping to get a middle school title. Maybe one day he will. Lol.

Good luck to all the youth kids Sunday. When all the kids climb up on that podium to get their medal look at their faces. Let me know if the kids care they are not the "true state champion"

Well said

[raidercoach 51]

If we are not trying to set this up like the middle school and high school state tournament, why is it so important to have it Alltech? (I know that the middle school state is held elsewhere) I dislike that set up for high school, so it wouldn't hurt my feelings at all to have the youth tournament somewhere else. Why put the youth on the same level "Alltech" as the high school? I respectfully, disagree. True weight classes, weigh ins, and qualifying tournaments, that's wrestling.

Having it at Alltech encourages youth families to attend the high school tournament on Saturday. Seeing our state's best high school kids and the spectacle of the finals is the best advertisement our state can offer to keep kids and families interested in wrestling.

I know many disagree, but having true weight classes will encourage weight cutting AND create problems distributing the competition. We'd have to have about 4 70lb brackets with weight classes. If that's the case, can those kids really call themselves a "true" 70 lb champ? Absolutely not. The best part of the 10% rule, aside from discouraging weight cutting, is it allows the tournament directors to spread the competition so every bracket is full. Otherwise, we'd have a huge log jam at some weights and half full brackets in many others. We've crunched the numbers many times and there is no avoiding it with weight classes. I think next year we move to 16 man brackets and continue the 10% rule. That makes the brackets a lot more competitive.

[Pinned 0]

This topic was not meant to bash youth wrestling I tip my hat to the many people that set all these tournaments up and to the people that put in the many hours away from family to try and make this sport top notch. We have to make coaches and teams more accountable for not telling the truth but we have to have rules in place to be able to do this. we need weight classes we need regionals to mean something a kid should have to wrestle his way into state. we could also have the state tournament open for those kids that didn't place at regionals just not in the same brackets as our kids that placed at regionals. I don't know what the answer is like I said I give all the respect in the world to the ones that are over this. I would like to see a true state champ at the youth level my kid I don't think is that advanced yet but I want him to have a fair chance to place as high as his ability will allow him. That is all I am saying and this is not over just one kid its about all the kids it should be a fair shake for all the young wrestlers in the state.

[sbfraz 8]

Nobody has said what the criteria for the weight checks at the podium will be. My son is two pounds lighter than the biggest kid in his bracket, so can he load up at dinner tonight or do we need to watch it like we usually do? I know it's silly, but seriously, if you are going to do this, some guidelines need to be set.

I'm all for weight checks/weigh ins, but I can't imagine that this will be well received tomorrow since there was no advance notice and most weigh ins were at 9 am a week ago. The afternoon kids will eat breakfast, lunch and healthy snacks to keep up energy during the tourney. Even very honest/legitimate weights have the potential to be off by a few pounds. This could be very interesting to watch:)

[Conrad 0]

Sbfraz, As far as i know they're just checking weights to compare from what was actually sent in. No consequences toward the wrestlers.

[IWIN 49]

Where can you find the brackets?

[Sport Family 0]

In reference to all the hoopla about true weight classes and true state champions at the youth level, some people have brought up some good points and many others ridiculous. Seems that too many parents are so worried about their child losing or not being viewed by their own adult friends as a winner has driven some to point fingers at others. Raidercoach is the only one that has said numerous times that this is for the kids. I can remember a few years back the youth state tournament being held at Fern Creek High School.  The tournament was handled nicely but the kids did not walk into that venue and have that little bit of WOW factor as walking into Alltech or Frankfort for that matter. If a coach is sending in false weights then that is totally on him/her and should be dealt with accordingly.  Most of us know throughout the season which kids are close to ours in weight in our own region. If a coach needs to fudge a childs weight for glory then maybe he/she is not that good of a coach afterall.  I like the idea of all kids wrestling regionals and advancing to state regardless of wins and losses.  At this age many of the kids are far more superior than others and that is totally okay.  There are more parents that leave tournaments feeling like losers and winners than kids. If singling out kids at the elementary levels is the answer, then how would people feel about that applying to other sports? Maybe we should suggest to all the local baseball organizations to do away with T-Ball. If the 4,5, or 6 year old can't hit a live pitch then baseball is not gonna be his/her sport. All kids deserve the opportunity to grow and us as adults have to learn to accept the losing and winning as easy as they do.  Our job as parents and coaches is not to drive our kids to reach goals that we could or couldn't, but to teach them how to be an adult as we watch them grow.  And just so you know, my child has wrestled up in weight most of the season and done quite well.  There are a few kids that are 10-15 lbs lighter than him that he can't handle.  IMO weight is not quite as important as most make it out. For example, Bobby Bryant from Trinity won the 285 lb class.  He weighs 220 lbs.

[deadlift 1]

You absolutely must challenge a kid if you are confident he is over weight. We need to expose the "cheaters". Our region weighs in as a region. It's a legit weigh in, granted it is over a week before state so I'm sure there is some fluctuation, but there is no cheating.

Tennessee is far from the top echelon of wrestling. I doubt many believe they are much better than Kentucky if at all.

Tennessee has a pretty good AAU system IMO.  You weigh in for every tournament and they are all on trackwrestling.  We have a TOP 100 series with 4-5 tournaments spead out across the state that brings in much of our state's top talent.  You sign up for our Saturday tournaments on trackwrestling by midnight Thursday night and physically weigh in the day of the tournament.  If the kid is over weight then you can pay a bump up fee to be placed in the appropriate bracket.  All of our weigh ins for the TOP 100, Regional and State tournaments are conducted on Friday evening at satellite weighin sights. A referee is present at each weigh in site to conduct and certify the weighins.   All the TOP 100, Regional, and State tournaments also use the dashboard on trackwrestling for near immediate results.  We do have one TOP 100 tournament left for the season which takes place this Saturday, FEB 23 near Knoxville.  Some in KY already visit us often.  This would be a great chance to see another way of doing things and possibly even find some competition by heading south instead of north.  

[Bluesdad 73]

We will be checking the medalists as they wait in line on Sunday. I agree that it is not the kids that are cheating but the coaches submitting the weights/rosters. And if there are issues my guess is there will be consistent issues for certain teams/clubs. And we need to expose them and implement processes to address this in the future. And maybe we will find that in general everything is fine and weights are okay.

Here's my problem with this. When the kids got there medals today(evening session) they were wearing 4lbs of cloths at least counting there singlets, shoes, shorts, shirts, sweat shirts, knee pads, etc. They would have probably already have ate 3 times and had some junk food so they were going to weigh in heavy. So I'd say if a kid weighted 70lbs by the time he weighted in today he would've been at least 76-77 lbs counting the cloths. Because I know when my son weights in in his boxers. So I didn't understand this unless the kid is 10-12 lbs over then they were probably an issue with their weight to begin with.

[sbfraz 8]

Here's my problem with this. When the kids got there medals today(evening session) they were wearing 4lbs of cloths at least counting there singlets, shoes, shorts, shirts, sweat shirts, knee pads, etc. They would have probably already have ate 3 times and had some junk food so they were going to weigh in heavy. So I'd say if a kid weighted 70lbs by the time he weighted in today he would've been at least 76-77 lbs counting the cloths. Because I know when my son weights in in his boxers. So I didn't understand this unless the kid is 10-12 lbs over then they were probably an issue with their weight to begin with.

I agree. My son weighed in at 54.8 in his boxers on 2/08. He always wrestles Intermediate 55 when we wrestle out of state where they do weigh ins and weight classes. He weighed in under 55 at Indy Nationals two weeks ago. Yesterday he weighed 57.8 at 4:30pm with shoes, singlet, shirt and after eating two meals and snacks. We never fudge our weights, so I'd hate to be labeled a cheater when I'm not. However, if all the results being over causes us to have official weigh ins next year, I'm glad he was 3 pounds over:)

[Bluesdad 73]

I agree. My son weighed in at 54.8 in his boxers on 2/08. He always wrestles Intermediate 55 when we wrestle out of state where they do weigh ins and weight classes. He weighed in under 55 at Indy Nationals two weeks ago. Yesterday he weighed 57.8 at 4:30pm with shoes, singlet, shirt and after eating two meals and snacks. We never fudge our weights, so I'd hate to be labeled a cheater when I'm not. However, if all the results being over causes us to have official weigh ins next year, I'm glad he was 3 pounds over:)

I agree 100%. My son weighed in at 71lbs fat on tuesday(he usually wrestles 70 out of state tourneys according to what he weighs) I think it was. Yesterday with all his clothes on and after eating all day he weighed 76. But I'm with you if this makes them have actual weight classes I'm fine with that.

[raidercoach 51]

I agree 100%. My son weighed in at 71lbs fat on tuesday(he usually wrestles 70 out of state tourneys according to what he weighs) I think it was. Yesterday with all his clothes on and after eating all day he weighed 76. But I'm with you if this makes them have actual weight classes I'm fine with that.

How did your team/region conduct their weigh ins? Was it done as a region with a certified referee?

[Bluesdad 73]

Certified referee as a team this year. We usually do it as a region wirh certified referee but our regional tourney got cancelled because of snow. Blue was at middle school state the same day as our regional would've been so it worked out pretty good for him I guess.

[Ranger123 43]

Not sure what all the concern is with checking weights. So much fear about eating and having on sweats. As I saw it everyone was in the same boat yesterday. It was actually quite comical to see the concerns of so many dads. That tells me there is something to be looking into. Either some weight cutting or something questionable. The problem comes when your kid is 10 pounds heavier than all the other kids who also ate 2 meals and junk and had on lots of clothes. This isn't a witch hunt. Just making sure the kids are all being treated fairly.

[sbfraz 8]

I have no problem with the checks, so I hope I didn't imply that. I would just prefer to do actual weigh ins. I'm sure most of the kids were over by a few pounds, but I'm also sure there were some that were WAY over. My suggestion would be to do weigh ins the morning of the tourney or the night before. Then just enter the data in the bracketing program and spit the brackets out.

We don't need to have coaches moving kids around because they are "on the same team or region." This just looks bad and that person could be perceived to be trying to gain an advantage. Either do weight classes or go straight down the line with the weights and make 16 man brackets. If the computer makes the brackets, coaches and parents can't complain. It's cut and dry.

It would add that much time. There plenty of scales around because of high school state. Set up a room with 10 scales, sort the kids alphabetically, send them to the correct scale and enter the weight in the spreadsheet, send the spreadsheet to the program and print the brackets. Or better yet, do it all in Trackwrestling!

[85mc 0]

seem`s to be more people in favor of set weight classes.

i understand the argument with morning weigh ins adding time to the tournament.

so why not use regions as a true qualifier for state with only the top 2 or 3 kids from each class & region going to state.yes it`s about the kids but they need to learn how to lose also.Some have said set weights promote weight cutting we weigh our kids at every practice so we know if anything like this might be going on and to date have had no problems.Has a coach or parent if you suspect any type of unhealthy practices it is your job to report it!

[Wmom 0]

Can anyone just say thank you for all of the hard work that was put into this tournament? I understand that everyone sees things that could be changed or improved but could you just start with a simple thank you first?

[2yankees3 2]

First;  Thank you!  Great day of wrestling.  Everyone that was involved in putting the tournament together deserve a big pat on the back.  We all had a great time.  We had 21 kids wrestle and they all had fun.  Even the ones who didn't  wrestle as well as they wished had fun.  That is what it is all about.  Most people can find some minor fault with anything that they under take much less a tournament with nearly 1000 kids.  I personally think that message boards are not the place to point out any percieved faults.  There are always room for improvements and the place to undertake these are at the meetings.  I will say that the medals were awesome.  It is sad for the KHSAA that the youth medals were twice the size and of a much better design than the high school medals.