Camps vs. tournaments?

[dutch 178]

I'm curious on which people prefer during the off season. We have debated which is better for improving a wrestler during the off season. I believe both is good. I think the camps and different coaches showing different techniques works well. I think kids pick up different moves from different people. I think a wrestler takes a little from each coach he see's. As far as tournaments I would say that's when I see the biggest improvements. I think the more mat time they start to mature and figure things out. I am curious what other people think.

[Dixie Holub 0]

I think it depends on the level of the wrestler. Kids that have been wrestling for a number of years will get more out of camps. Most of the things that are taught at camps the kids have learned through regular practice, therefore it helps to hone the overall skill level. That being said, kids that are new or newer to the sport need to get matches under their belts. I learned much more from my losses than I ever did from winning. I don’t think you can go wrong with a healthy balance of both tourneys and camps. This way, with the skills built at a camp, every wrestler has a chance to use what has been taught at the camp in real time match situations, which is much different than a practice partner only going 50-75%.

[trithis 34]

The combination of the two is always going to be the ticket, in my mind. Kids get to see new stuff and grow and learn with camps and then they get to use what they have learned in tournaments that aren't pressure filled like during the season. They get to have fun and get better without feeling any consequences.

[PinAndWin 64]

Drilling is where it's at. The more a kid drills a move the more likely they'll use it in a match and the more confortable they'll be on the mat in competition. Repetition creates muscle memory. Less thinking, they'll just hit the right move at the right moment. I think whether you drill at home with a partner or you do camps, it's the repetition that ultimately makes you better. Yes, matches are important to raise the bar to show where you're at. One could argue that matches are the way to compete with the best, but if your going to the right camps you'll always have great partners to push you. There are plenty of good options within a 2 to 3 hour radius of our area. I think consistency in where you train is important. Finding a good place to train and sticking with it, I find really helps. Jumping around to this camp and that camp I think can be counter productive. Coaches are going to spend more time with those that are there all the time. Drilling/Camps first, matches second. Also, doing mostly camps during the summer takes the pressure off a little bit. Having to get amped up for matches and making weight all summer gets to be draining. I think it's good for them to get a little break and I've found they're excited about starting the new season to see how much better they've gotten. Just may 2 cents...

[dutch 178]

Thanks for the feedback. I think coming from you guys that have raised some pretty tough wrestlers you have a good idea of what it takes. I know there are a lot of different ideas about this. I agree with both of you guys. We have been to many different camps and coaches. Jordans's is the one that we continue to go to over and over again. He has a way of getting the best out of a wrestler. Not to mention the room is packed with studs. it has been good to see the same kids that 6 months ago you couldn't score on to closing the gap. That seems to build confidence. Thanks again for the feedback and it seems like there are a lot of parents an coaches who are passionate about the sport in general not just their team or kid.

[trithis 34]

I know there are many camps out there that teach different things, but I haven't seen a camp or system like Jordan's teaches, that pounds drilling the moves that they teach so much. What a great thing to watch if you haven't done so already. Yes, I agree that you have to drill and drill often to become proficient, and develop muscle memory, however, you have to learn or be taught the move to be able to drill it somewhere and you have to be able to test your achieved skill somewhere to see if your getting it. Camps or Tournaments? Still a combination of both in my mind....add in Drilling and you have a tough trio to beat.

[Mpire 76]

Well in the off season its usually time for camps and a few bigger tournaments in season is when you wrestle tournys every week when an dif you wrestle freestyle and Greco it changes because the seasons are different im not sure how people handle it duiring football season or when kids do multiple sports i always tried to get the kids to wrestle here and there once or twice a week duiring Football season just to stay a little sharp ,if your kid is only a wrestler i would still suggest taking a bit of a break for a couple months maybe focus on lifting or some other type of cross training .You cant go wrong with camps if it comes down to a choice of a camp or a tourny it depends if its a national tourny that is a massive goal for the year of course do the tournament if its just some ordinary Tourny "and this is the catch because they are ALL the big one LOL"i wouldnt turn down a decent camp .

After watching the Olympics i think it will become clear that simply wrestling will not do it anymore and these guys are not just cross training they are jacked up packing muscle that doesnt come from plyometric or isometric movements they are throwing around some iron along with a lot of core stuff .

its a combination all the wrestling cardio and drilling in the world is not going to do you any good when there is someone covering more bases .

HULK SMASH watching Boroughs was very fun he never stopped pushing through his shot he had great power and technique at least once he comitted to a shot.The Iranian he beat had great position and he still penetrated with his shot it was awesome to watch .

wresting and many sports are about explosiveness explosion explosion explosion ,i had a friend in High School who always said the key to muscle development is explosion well the key to many sports is EXPLOSION and it comes from wrestling drilling and throwing around heavy weights with proper technique movements that combine multiple muscle groups sometimes in combination moves are the best Snatch Clean and Press ,deadlift and Squats are great ,Deadlift being top dog for wrestling ,nothing else lets a person use such heavy weights in an explosive movement ,picture any throw and it takes that massive hip /back power and high crotch takes that leg and back strength ,even holding a stance for long periods like in a match requires unreal lower back strength ,how many times have you seen a match won or lost in the later periods when wrestlers get tired and have to stand upp because .........you guessed it their lower back is tired ,,,,,,you fix this with deadlifts ,hypers and rows ,.I know i wandered way of course but i was making a point and hopefully it helps some people ,

A hint for all the youth parents its not the cost of training that makes a kid good its the effort and actual training itself ,pick four wrestling specific moves do them in a row no rest for three then four then five sets then start timing your kids trying to decrease time every week ,there is no other training core or otherwise that is any better in season when trying to maintain strength and hold your weight ,its quick intense and helps your kid peak as the season progresses ,its proven effective on and against wrestlers at all levels from youth up .there you have the best wrestling workout on the planet Guaranteed no BS no hype and guess what ...........it was FREE .

By wrestling specific moves i meant lifting moves such as Clean and press Lunges ,chins pullovers ,incline fly presses ,rows ,whichever you choose just make sure you have all the muscle groups covered and do the clean and Presses regardless ,

Pullovers work the tie ups and clinch ,rows work the set ups the pushing and pulling used to move an opponent for a shot ,flyes work the muscles used in a cross face ,Clean and Press works your whole body ,there are some other very good moves with slight changes from traditional lifts that are excellent for wrestling as well .

something to do for kids who cannot make camps or make the gym there are always ways around adversity ,after suffering a severe back and neck injury that made training right away impossible for me a couple years back i ran with two rocks one in each hand every night doing curls flyes presses and stopping when my legs got tired and hit push ups and sit ups doing this along with weight training whenever i could enabled me at 42 yrs old to drop nearly 60 lbs in less than a year from 276 fat weak and injured to 218 good shape decent strength and still injured but a bit happier ,there is always a way around adversity and you might just come up with something new and better if you believe in what you are doing and are intense and consistent with your training and this is a key component to training a kid he has to believe in what he is doing and who is telling him what to do That is only one of the reasons i say I am the greatest Trainer in the universe ,the other reason is I Am ,been there done that and everything i touch turns to gold , the mind is the greatest muscle ,Make it tough and make it fun and all these youth kids in KY will dominate i see a future full of D1 wrestlers from KY .

[PinAndWin 64]

Dutch, I think the way to get your son in a position to be the best that he can be is doing what you're doing now. Asking a lot of questions, being open minded enough to listen to other opinions and also be willing to sacrifice a hell of a lot of time and money to getting him there. Sounds like you are well on your way. I would chill a little on the matches and focus on the technique and drilling through camps and open mats. I thought Mpire's comments about the strength training were awesome...the man obviously knows his stuff. Looking forward to watching your son progress.

[dutch 178]

Pinandwin thanks for the feedback. Mason and I have watched your son for years. My son has always looked up to him. I have made references to your son style and build to mason over the years. Its funny how wrestling goes through phases with the kids. When they are in youth they look up to the older kids and want to be just like them. Same style, singlets, even the shoes. I joke about that but its so true. Now that my son is getting older I see the little youth kids looking up to him the same way. I explain to him how important it is to spend time talking to them and showing them moves. He understands that it is important just like it was important when he was younger. He enjoys it so much. now he is fascinated by the austin and stephen. I can say they go out of their way to show him attention and also show him moves. I that's what is all about. I love to see kids grow and remember they were little once too. Thanks again for all the people that give back to better the sport. Good luck to logan this year. He is a beast

[bigdaddycoach 4]

As noted above, it depends a lot on the quality of the camps and the tournaments. There are few training methods more productive than a high-quality camp like Jordan or a few others, especially for a wrestler who has advanced to the point where they are ready to apply the lessons they learn. Tournaments are much less predictable. I think a wrestler is generally going to get more from a tough 2-hour practice than an "easy" tournament, especially one against wrestlers he already knows. To me, tournaments are most useful in keeping young wrestlers motivated to keep practicing in the offseason. Mpire also makes an important point about taking a few weeks off every year. I like to remind parents that developing a young wrestler is a marathon, not a sprint. I'm sure we all have seen guys who were world-beaters in 8th grade, but never made it to their senoir year.

[PinAndWin 64]

Thanks Dutch for the kind words but he has a lot of work to do and he knows it. On and off the mat.

[dutch 178]

Don't they all. LOL

[hoosierdad 1]

New place in New Albany, might be of interest for off-season strength training!

http://www.clarkfloydcrossfit.com/

[KY Crush 2]

^{Seems like a great place hoosierdad they cover nutrition as well as cross training and the myofascial stretching made popular by Parillo and some of the other gurus back in the 80s when done correctly it is anything but comfortable as they tried to make it appear im not sure rolling on some cushions achieves its true purpose but i guess that is why it was called deep myofascial stretching back then "it hurts like Heck,It may be or could be a perfect training atmosphere i prefer a bit more powerlifting type room but seeing women hitting cleans and working on the tires is impressive .i wish i were in the area i would definatly take my kids there ,if it doesnt' cost an arm and a leg .}