elementary states

[Savage 5]

For the record I agree that there should eventually be one state champion but what was said before about walking before you run is right on target. If you look at the progression the state tourney has made just in the past year ( 1 session broken into 2 sessions; this year adding required participation at the regional tourney, which by the way regionals never even existed) you can see things are on the right track. Maybe next year the top 2,3, or 4 wrestlers from each region only qualify for state. I forget how many regions are at the youth level. Then things start rounding into form that maybe people from both sides of the argument can live with. I do think however, that at this point on the growing process we are doing fine because we ARE growing and we ARE progressing and improving!

[Louisville Wrestling 0]

I agree with jpizar83! I heard three different kids mention that they didn't like the multiple champion thing! Everyone underestimates these kids! They think their just repeating what they heard their parents or another adult complain about, and that's so not true! They can think & comprehend what's going on on their own! Now I understand 5, 6, 7, 8 year-olds thinking that every tournament seems like the State Championship, but some of our kids the older ones 9, 10, 11, 12 year-olds are more aware of whats going on, and actually do speak their mind without any influence! They have single champions in every other sport! Basketball, Baseball, Boxing, Football and whatever else that a child plays at the youth level! My son has one more year left for the elementary division and he's already said that he does not wanna wrestle State next year because of this (WITHOUT MY INFLUENCE)! If it's just about participation why not use other tournaments throughout the season to promote participation of the sport? 

[Zeus 117]

I understand that it is difficult to accomodate everyone and it would take a lot of planning and work for one true state champion but that doesn't mean it shouldn't be strived for.

[WHS98 34]

Wow I didn't know Kentucky set the bar for Elementry wrestling.All these other states must have a bunch of, well as Mike said it Idiots.I know Ind. had 37 kids in their 70lb class,  darn how big of idiots they must be,them along with Iowa,Ohio etc.I also seen were Kentucky dominated the NCAA nationals this past weekend.Mike I guess everyone that wants to bring Ky up to the level of these other states are idiots.People have every right to get on here and try to help improve wrestling in our state.Louisvillewrestling is dead on, when he said a lot of kids themselves and not the parents don't want multipule brackets.I guess the 10,11,12yr olds that have been wrestling for years and get in a bracket against a kid thats been wrestling for 1 month and pin them in 20 sec. are not smart enough to figure things out for themselves.What good did a match like that do for either kid ? NOTHING.But I am not bashing the system we are trying to move forward.So here is an Idea to throw out there- -We have 4 regions,-8 man brackets are needed at this time-we need to promote participation-young kids like to get awards to keep them involved.So why not take the top 2 in each region, I am an idiot but I think that is 8.Put them in 1-bracket so you have the kids with the most experience together.Call them the Elementry State Champ.All the rest of the tournament is keep the same but the kids that win the other brackets are called the JV Elementry state champs.If the kid is new to wrestling he will not care his medal said JV,and the other kids,parents ,coaches etc will know the true state champ.But its just an idea and it don't mean much to me because my son is finished with elementry.

[Indians40 2]

we have 6 regions currently

[WHS98 34]

thanks Indian I didn't know that.Shoots my idea down.

[Louisville Wrestling 0]

Thanks WHS98! That sounds like a great system to try out!

[Zeus 117]

KY doesn't set the bar for elementary wrestling but that doesn't mean we shouldn't strive to be the best.  I have all the confidence in the world that KY can be the best wrestling state in the country, but it will take A LOT of hard work by our coaches and wrestlers.  If you aren't interested in being the best then I say get out of the sport because wrestling is too hard of a sport to just be in it for fun.  If you want to just have fun then go play basketball.  However if you want to be a "gladiator" and know that you're a badass then come join my team because I'm going to push you to be the best you can be.  This training will in turn help the kids later in life when it slaps them in the face and they learn that they have to work their asses off to get what they want.

The kids on my team worked their butts off all season and at the state tournament some of them, on their own, asked me how they could be a "state champion" when there was more than one bracket per weight class.  These kids want to be the best and they aren't afraid of competition.  I got a couple of them some exhibition matches but it wasn't the same.  My point is that we should be working towards the goal of having one bracket per weight class.  I understand that it may not be possible right now considering the resources and the level of wrestling in our state but that doesn't mean we shouldn't be striving for it.  If your kids can't handle a loss or are satisfied with a "half or third" of a state championship then they need to try another sport because my kids are coming for you next season and they want to be the best, bar none.

[CCSTAT 0]

KY doesn't set the bar for elementary wrestling but that doesn't mean we shouldn't strive to be the best.  I have all the confidence in the world that KY can be the best wrestling state in the country, but it will take A LOT of hard work by our coaches and wrestlers.  If you aren't interested in being the best then I say get out of the sport because wrestling is too hard of a sport to just be in it for fun.  If you want to just have fun then go play basketball.  However if you want to be a "gladiator" and know that you're a badass then come join my team because I'm going to push you to be the best you can be.  This training will in turn help the kids later in life when it slaps them in the face and they learn that they have to work their asses off to get what they want.

The kids on my team worked their butts off all season and at the state tournament some of them, on their own, asked me how they could be a "state champion" when there was more than one bracket per weight class.  These kids want to be the best and they aren't afraid of competition.  I got a couple of them some exhibition matches but it wasn't the same.  My point is that we should be working towards the goal of having one bracket per weight class.  I understand that it may not be possible right now considering the resources and the level of wrestling in our state but that doesn't mean we shouldn't be striving for it.  If your kids can't handle a loss or are satisfied with a "half or third" of a state championship then they need to try another sport because my kids are coming for you next season and they want to be the best, bar none.

(If your kids can't handle a loss or are satisfied with a "half or third" of a state championship then they need to try another sport because my kids are coming for you next season and they want to be the best, bar none.)

What kind of a statement is this?  Please let me know when you're coming to my town.  I'll be sure to bar the windows and lock the doors.  Isn't that what EVERYBODY does when the big, bad Woodford comes to town.  Get a grip.

[Ranger123 43]

KY doesn't set the bar for elementary wrestling but that doesn't mean we shouldn't strive to be the best.  I have all the confidence in the world that KY can be the best wrestling state in the country, but it will take A LOT of hard work by our coaches and wrestlers.  If you aren't interested in being the best then I say get out of the sport because wrestling is too hard of a sport to just be in it for fun.  If you want to just have fun then go play basketball.  However if you want to be a "gladiator" and know that you're bad then come join my team because I'm going to push you to be the best you can be.  This training will in turn help the kids later in life when it slaps them in the face and they learn that they have to work their butts off to get what they want.

The kids on my team worked their butts off all season and at the state tournament some of them, on their own, asked me how they could be a "state champion" when there was more than one bracket per weight class.  These kids want to be the best and they aren't afraid of competition.  I got a couple of them some exhibition matches but it wasn't the same.  My point is that we should be working towards the goal of having one bracket per weight class.  I understand that it may not be possible right now considering the resources and the level of wrestling in our state but that doesn't mean we shouldn't be striving for it.  If your kids can't handle a loss or are satisfied with a "half or third" of a state championship then they need to try another sport because my kids are coming for you next season and they want to be the best, bar none.

I was starting to listen to you a bit until this post.  Wow, a little overboard if I would say.  I'm right there pushing my boy(s) to be the best as well.  But have you forgotten that this is wrestling and elementary wrestling at that.  There are many way more important things in this world.

And to the multiple bracket discussion.  I don't think anyone supporting multiple brackets is opposed to a single state champion, when the state is ready to make that progression.  Right now we are not ready for a state qualifier.  And we didn't really grow participation at the state tournament as much as many expected.  I really don't care.  My boy was in an age/weight where there were many brackets (6).  His was by far the stacked bracket.  He wrestled tough, but didn't even make the final.  But he won a medal and we were pretty happy with his performance.  Since state, he pinned one of the "state champs" and another finalist.  He was very likely the 3rd best out of the 40 kids at state.  5 of those other kids were state champs.  He wasn't.  He is learning and progressing and that is what counts at this point.  WE don't care about the multiple brackets.  It is what it is.  Wrestle the guys in your bracket.  That's all you can do.  Besides, how does having multiple brackets hurt any kid.  I think it is obviously more fair to do this and have an efficiently run tournament.  If you and the kids can't handle having multiple state champs, how are you going to be able to live with yourselves in middle school when you have to forfeit after you hit the 5 match limit at state.

And as has been said on many, many occassions for all of those keyboard complainers...  If you don't like the way the system is working, get in there and try to fix it. 

[Frank 0]

Well said Ranger. I thank you for your perspective.

I was starting to listen to you a bit until this post.  Wow, a little overboard if I would say.  I'm right there pushing my boy(s) to be the best as well.  But have you forgotten that this is wrestling and elementary wrestling at that.  There are many way more important things in this world.

And to the multiple bracket discussion.  I don't think anyone supporting multiple brackets is opposed to a single state champion, when the state is ready to make that progression.  Right now we are not ready for a state qualifier.  And we didn't really grow participation at the state tournament as much as many expected.  I really don't care.  My boy was in an age/weight where there were many brackets (6).  His was by far the stacked bracket.  He wrestled tough, but didn't even make the final.  But he won a medal and we were pretty happy with his performance.  Since state, he pinned one of the "state champs" and another finalist.  He was very likely the 3rd best out of the 40 kids at state.  5 of those other kids were state champs.  He wasn't.  He is learning and progressing and that is what counts at this point.  WE don't care about the multiple brackets.  It is what it is.  Wrestle the guys in your bracket.  That's all you can do.  Besides, how does having multiple brackets hurt any kid.  I think it is obviously more fair to do this and have an efficiently run tournament.  If you and the kids can't handle having multiple state champs, how are you going to be able to live with yourselves in middle school when you have to forfeit after you hit the 5 match limit at state.

And as has been said on many, many occassions for all of those keyboard complainers...  If you don't like the way the system is working, get in there and try to fix it. 

[Irish Wrestler 10]

Well put Ranger! 

[Kentucky10 0]

Well put Ranger! 

Ranger when are the pre season elem. rankings coming out?? j/k :-D

[Ranger123 43]

Ranger when are the pre season elem. rankings coming out?? j/k :-D

I started to post them and decided there wasn't any point.  My boys are #1 at every age/weight.

[Zeus 117]

Sorry if I came off a little harsh but my intent was to say that the key in developing wrestling in our state is the youth programs.  If you get the kids involved early (like 5, 6, and 7) then it will pay off serious dividends in 15 years.  If more kids are wrestling at a younger age, the more competitive they are and therefore the more they want to be the best.  Coach Carr always told me the best thing about Harrison Courtney was his hatred of losing and how easy it was to channel that energy into getting better, I think they said the same thing about Michael Jordan and Kobe Bryant.  I think this competitiveness is developed at an early age so therefore we should start our wrestlers off at earlier ages.  I'll bet you that almost every single NCAA champion this year started wrestling when they were less than 10 years old and almost all of their states had youth state tournaments where the the kids had to qualify and the state champion was the "true" state champ.

KY doesn't set the bar for elementary wrestling but that doesn't mean we shouldn't strive to be the best.  I have all the confidence in the world that KY can be the best wrestling state in the country but it will take A LOT of hard work by our coaches and wrestlers.  I understand that it may not be possible right now considering the resources and the level of wrestling in our state but that doesn't mean we shouldn't be striving for it.

Again I never said that Kentucky is at this level now; like I said before it will take time to develop this.

ML,

Ranger when are the pre season elem. rankings coming out?? j/k :-D

I know you meant this as a joke but they have national rankings for youth wrestling so why not state rankings.  I want to take KY wrestling to a place we've never been before, where we're competing on the national level with multiple national champs, World Team members, Olympic medalists, etc.  I guess my frustration is with those who say that KY is ready for this now (which I agree with) and therefore should accept defeat on the national level for our youth.  Who knows your cousins could be the first NCAA champs from KY.

[Zeus 117]

By the way I want to make it clear that as a coach my emphasis is not about winning at all.  This doesn't mean that I don't want my wrestlers to win, obviously I would love gold medals for every kid every weekend.  However the most important thing to me is that he is a better wrestler after the match than before the match, that he learned something.  With this mindset I am not shooting for the elementary, middle school or even high school state champioships.  I would rather have a kid who is successful in life rather than every wins one wrestling match because ultimately "hard work overcomes talent when talent doesn't work hard".  If a wrestler puts this sort of effort forward then they are undoubtedly get results because wrestling is that kind of sport, you get out of it what you put into it.  They will in turn be able to use this work ethic in whatever profession they choose in life.  I only give them an avenue in which to learn what it takes to be successful.  I guess that's why wrestling is such a special sport.

[Ranger123 43]

jp - glad you clarified.  I think we can all agree with your last statements.

[Frank 0]

I certainly do. We have kids as young as 4 in our program. We had one this year who only attended practices. That whole extra season being exposed to the sport will give him an advantage over 1st year 5 year olds next season when he actually competes. He will be a 1st year wrestler with 1 year of experience. We have another 4 year old (now 5) who wrestled in the CYW all season and did pretty good but was too young to compete in the state tournament. He was able to compete in regionals and finished 3rd in the 5 & 6 division. He will have 2 years experience next year with 1st year status at state. That kinda jump on the competition at that age is huge. We are able to make it fun and also teach a competitive spirit. All of our kids know how to score and the importance of being ahead going into the 3rd period. They also like to play kangaroo & bulldog as well as other games in practice. The key to success is coaching the kids at their level. Most will mature to into a good competitive wrestler very quickly if they enjoy what they are doing and look foreward to going to practice. So I can see what you are talking about. Some kids are ready for the hard competition and can handle the agony of defeat. Most of those kids were born into the wrestling family or some kind of competitive atmosphere. We will definitely get to that point in Kentucky. When you have a vision for the future time passes too slowly. Hang in there.

[jacob_todd2000@yahoo.com 0]

What are the top two wrestlers at each weight class for 11 and 12 year old's?

blake nelson is the best wrestler in elemtary school. from richmond.

[jacob_todd2000@yahoo.com 0]

blake nelson is the best elemtary school wrestler out there. from richmond

[Frank 0]

blake nelson is the best elemtary school wrestler out there. from richmond

Which wt. class?

[jacob_todd2000@yahoo.com 0]

i think between 145-170. he is around there but i dont know for real sure. but no matter what weight class he is the best.

[Zeus 117]

jp - glad you clarified.  I think we can all agree with your last statements.

Good, but if we all strive for this then we should be striving to have "true" state champions at the elementary level like OH and PA.  I may seem like I am complaining about this but I don't mean to.  Rather I am interested in what it would take to make this happen.  I am willing to volunteer my time and host the tournament next season if need be.  I'm sure we can find a venue here in Lexington if we start looking now.  So what exactly the problems and more importantly how can (they) be addressed?

[Ranger123 43]

Good, but if we all strive for this then we should be striving to have "true" state champions at the elementary level like OH and PA.  I may seem like I am complaining about this but I don't mean to.  Rather I am interested in what it would take to make this happen.  I am willing to volunteer my time and host the tournament next season if need be.  I'm sure we can find a venue here in Lexington if we start looking now.  So what exactly the problems and more importantly how can (they) be addressed?

Mr. Martin will have to address what ALL of the issues are.  I think the biggest one is that it is still an open tournament and that can result in some large brackets.  This presents numerous concerns (5 match rule, organization/errors).  A lesser issues is likely team scoring.  Plus, a point I already mentioned, who does it really hurt to have multiple brackets?  Would it be any different if they broke 40 kids weighing between 60.5 and 65 into 5 8-man 60 pound brackets (5 state champs) or set them up as 60.5-61.4, 61.8-62.3, etc (still 5 state champs, but technically different weights)?

[Zeus 117]

No I think the better idea would be to have a qualifying system, just like middle and high school.  It would be entirely possible because we had the regional tournaments anyway.  If a region had only one kid at a certain weight then he/she would automatically qualify.  If another region had a lot of kids at that weight then those kids could fill in the bracket for the state tournament to get the kids more matches.  I'd say have a max of 16 kids per weight in a specific age group.