grappler-of-old

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Posts posted by grappler-of-old

  1. Posted · Report reply

    13 minutes ago, Lowsingle said:

    This whole post season has not been enjoyable for fans, coaches or mostly importantly wrestlers. I was at Ryle this past weekend and I can honestly say that I have never been in a gym so long to only wrestle 16 man brackets. No hospitality room, one concession stand so the line was very long most of the day, no seating, restrooms were not big enough and floor space around the mats was not sufficient. Not to mention that the competition area was not legally set up according to rules that are in place for the safety of the athletes. The out of bounds lines were not far enough apart. There were a couple of places on the mats where you could stand with one foot in the wrestling area of two different mats. Most of these things are not the fault of Ryle coaches or admins, its just an issue with putting that many teams and fans in a high school gym. I am most certainly not looking forward to being packed into GRC this weekend. First of all the fact that we are making this a two day event is being ridiculous. 16 man brackets on 5 mats if done right should take about 6-8 hours max not two days. We are forcing parents of competitors to miss work on Friday if they want to watch their sons compete when the whole tournament can be wrestled on Saturday. Isn't that why we put in the 6th match rule for post season? So we all show up bright and early on Friday, while GRC is in school session, to watch 3 total rounds of wrestling. Those 3 rounds should be finished by about 5pm unless we take a bunch of useless breaks just to string out the days which only causes the fans and competitors to become more disgruntled. Now the teams that have to travel from the far ends of the state will go back to their hotel rooms, that they had to book for 2 nights instead of 1 night costing the team money that they probably didn't have, and find out how to kill time the rest of the evening. Then we will get up early and finish the tournament the next day but not without buying another $16 ticket and if you are lucky you can get one of those $75 KHSAA hoodies for your kid before you go home.

    Total cost for a family of 4 traveling to watch their kids compete:

    Hotel Room 2 nights $275

    Tickets for 4 both days: $128

    Fuel, Food, Merchandise: $300

    Total cost about $700ish for a tournament that could be done start to finish in 1 day. Not mention the fact that those same fans spent half that amount to go to the first round of state last weekend. We are doing our people and injustice. We are killing our sport by letting this happen. We will lose wrestlers next season because of our postseason. The wrestlers and their parents will leave this season with a sour taste in their mouths and they will remember what a circus it was this season,. 

    Not sure about the problem with a 2 day state.  If you want the parade of champions a face off and an awards ceremony, you would need 2 days. 

    Even back in ancient times when I wrestled and the state tourney was at Atherton with a 16 man bracket it was 2 days.  No one complained.  

    I don't like the 16 man state tourney at a high school.  All this changed with COVID and the expiration of the contract with the Horse Park. 

    Semi-State is the real joke.  We either need to return to District, Region, State (16 man bracket) or Region and state (32 man bracket).  

    I'm not sure how long you have been around, but the state tourney use to be at the Horse Park with a 32 man bracket.  The real complaint then was the Horse Park itself.  Finding a venue seems to be the biggest problem.  

  6. Posted · Report reply

    After looking at the flier sent out by KHSAA about procedures at the final round of the state tournament I have 2 questions. 

    Q#1.  Why is it that if an athlete gets injured the placements don't roll up?  I know we don't have an alternate but why wouldn't the placements roll up and make the bye at the 8th place?  I know the kneejerk answer will be that the athlete entered the state semi-state and now he is out and it becomes a FF.  But don't we want the best matchups?  We have argued for decades about seeding the state tourney, and now that we are essentially doing this with the semi-state tourney. 

    Q#2.  I asked this last year and never got a straight answer.  Why is it that all the top 4 placers at a semi state cannot make it to the semi's?  SS1 2nd and 3rd place finishers will meet in the quarters and vice versa.  Is this preferred by most of the people? I may be in the minority on this but I think that if the best 4 in the weight class are from the same semi-state then they should all be able to make it to the semifinals. 

     

  9. Posted · Report reply

    22 minutes ago, pin4thewin said:

    Personally I would love to have rules closer to college, I just don't think we can have riding time because of all the incompetent table workers. 4-Point nearfall would completely change the sport but I think it would be better.

    This is true.  But think about it.  If a kid gets a once in a lifetime throw (headlock) now he would get 2 takedown and 4 nearfall?  That's 6-0, it's hard enough to come back from 5-0. 

    I also like the idea that if the score is tied, you get put on your back for 3 NF you can still get an escape and a takedown to tie it up.  (More action, not just trying a throw)

    If you add a 3 point 1st takedown.  Ahhh. 

  10. Posted · Report reply

    Here are the first teams with their first state qualifier

    Bethlehem

    Butler

    Floyd Central

    Mason County

    Somerset

    South Warren

    Warren East

    Honorable Mention

    Ballard   last qualifier 2008

    East Carter  Last qualifier 2003

    Paintsville Last qualifier 1976

    Corbin   Last qualifier 1967

    This year there are 104 teams represented at the state tournament. The most ever. 

  11. Posted · Report reply

    3 hours ago, Tbagnky said:

    I'm sure that there are similar situations with other young ladies. Maybe GOO was right with the pool idea. However, that format makes for an extremely long day and can't be done with over 400 competitors and limited mat space.

    This is incorrect if you have a 24 person wt class.  A pool tourney will have 32 matches whereas a 32 man bracket ran the way it was done it had 42 matches. 

    Pool tourneys almost always run faster than full bracket tourneys. 

  12. Posted · Report reply

    I would encourage coaches and parents to admonish their athletes when they argue with an official.  If your son/daughter argues with an official (even if they may be correct) it should never be supported.  Coaches, only have (ONE) coach ask about a call.  Not the athlete, the assistant coach and head coach teaming up on an official.  

    As for coaches, if it is not the post season, does it really matter?  I know we all want to win, but allowing your athletes to see that sometimes things don't go your way is a huge lifelong lesson.  If we want the sport to grow then we need officials.  Give these young officials a break.  As I stated before, talk to them calmly after the fact.  It goes a long way to improving your relationship with the official and helps the official move forward.  Remember we all make mistakes.  I've made a lot in my advanced age. 

  13. Posted · Report reply

    That makes sense.  The younger the participants normally the younger and less experienced the coach.  

    One advise I would give young coaches is to talk to the officials after the event or at a break.  Ask how the call was made, don't argue about it (The call can't be changed now) just find out why the official made the call.  I have learned a great deal by doing this and I hope that the official I talked to know I am just trying to understand and learn myself.  We NEVER know all the answers. 

  15. Posted · Report reply

    1 hour ago, GentleBeard said:

     The only issue that one could potentially have is with the head ref stating that coaches are the reason there's not that many of them (referees). 

    I know I may be opening a can of worms here but::::::.   I would like to hear from some older officials that have been around for a long long time.  

    My question is this. are the coaches questioning/complaining/arguing more, less, or about the same as in the past.  I have been around for a long long time and I'm not sure I see a huge difference in the coaches now compared to yesteryear.  I actually believe that the coaches are arguing less.  You don't have the Joe Carr Sr. (Woo), Dave Madding (Scott) who would question or complain all the time.  I think that many officials have gotten rabbit ears.  Coaches in the corner will complain to each other about a call and the officials hear it and it gets to them.  

    It's the one problem our whole society is facing, a little criticism or disagreement does not have to end the world, especially if it is not directly said to you. 

    Then again I am probably wrong. My wife tells me I am all the time. :ph34r:

  18. Posted · Report reply

    With the addition of Girls next year and the added cost for that, I think that schools would really balk at having a 2 day tournament with an additional overnight stay.  That is the HUGE problem.

    I am not sure why there are only 5 regions in middle school.  I would guess it was made due to participation or the tournament running long.  There use to be 8 regions not so many years ago.  

  19. Posted · Report reply

    Something we can look into for the future would be something that Ohio does.  

    In the month of January (or al least a window, not sure of the exact dates) a weekday dual cannot occur unless in includes a dual against someone in their sectional.  By the end of the month each team will have wrestled everyone in their sectional revealing who the qualifier is for the state duals. This eliminates the need for a weekend sectional tournament.  

  20. Posted · Report reply

    20 minutes ago, Ranger123 said:

    Good points GOO.  Maybe let's go with 2nd week of Jan and 4th week.  Most teams already have a placeholder for state duals for the last week of the month.  The Dragon is a firmly established great in state event.  Let's not mess with that.  So 2nd week becomes Divisional state duals weekend.  Trinity already held a tough dual event that appeared to be open for a number of the top teams.

    Would that give us enough time to get the qualifier in? 

    Just being devil's advocate here.  2nd weekend in Jan, that is the Bryce Sheffler duals at Union and the Warhawk classic along with the Hammer and Anvil in Ohio. 

     

  21. Posted · Report reply

    17 hours ago, Jegators22 said:

    Just an idea to think about at the next coaches meeting, Ohio has 8 state qualifying tournaments for middle school. 4 on one weekend and 4 on a different weekend, taking top 4 each tournament for a full 32 man bracket. That helps with the situation of having 5 or 6 possible state placers coming from 1 region and leaving 1 or 2 of them not making the state tournament. No realignment needed, you would just need to decide who gets to host the 8 tournaments. 

    A couple of snags here.

    1.  Ohio does not allow middle school to wrestle High school, Ky does.  Adding another week to the post season will run into the high school post season, or state duals.  

    2.  The middle school 32 person tourney would then be a 2 day event.  Friday and Saturday, adding either another overnight stay to some or causing an overnight stay for others.  

    one more would be finding a venue big enough for the even, heck the high school can't even find one suitable for them to have a 32 person event. 

  22. Posted · Report reply

    27 minutes ago, halfhalfhalf said:

    I wrestled in a tourney this past summer called the old timers classic in Missouri. It was 1 min a 30 second break in between periods. It was a lot of fun.

    That sounds like just enough time for me to come to my senses and forfeit the next round. LOL. 

    Either that or have the coffin ready for me near the end of the match.  A whole new meaning to casket match.