Wrestling Dad

Anyone who has been to the Evansville Mater Dei tournament, or the Brentwood tournament (Nashville) and saw Ervin wrestle would have to say he is the best in Kentucky. Very skilled, very strong, very physical. Ready for college right now. Remember that the last 4X Kentucky state champion (Knable) pinned in the state championship match...and lost in the Mater Dei finals the same year. IMO - Ervin vs. Courtney would be a man wrestling a boy. Maybe his senior year Courtney would match up...but not this year. Frankly, I think there was one other wrestler in Kentucky who ranked right there with Ervin and Harrison...but I get chastised on this forum for ever mentioning his name (hint - Fern Creek).

I don't have the archives of the rankings, but I know that Joe Carr Jr. was nationally ranked as a high school senior. In fact, he wrestled for team USA in the Dapper Dan Classic (USA vs. Pennsylvania). Unfortunately, Joe Heskett caught him late in the match in a head/arm and pinned Joe. Heskett went on to a solid, all-american college career and Carr went on to star at West Virginia.

Maddog: What pioneer is saying is that we are generally not questioning what happened in a single match. We are not even questioning the fact that stalling should be called for passivity. We are not questioning that leg rides without an intent to turn is passive wrestling and should require a restart, and if persistent a stall warning. We agree with you on these points. And, by the way, like Pioneer I have been both a coach and an official. Our concern is that this year there was a noticeable difference in how officials approached passivity and stalling in the state tournament versus how they made calls during the regular season. Not just in one or two matches, but through the entire tournament. What we believe is owed the coaches and wrestlers is a consistent approach to this issue. From tournament to tournament, from official to official. I have been involved in wrestling as a high school wrestler, college wrestler, coach and official in seven states for 40 years (yikes, had to go back and figure that out - scary). I believe that the role of a wrestling official is to manage the match to the rule book. That means making certain that how individuals perform against the rules dictates the outcome of the match. They should never "influence" the outcome of the match, just manage the process to the rules. This absolutely demands a consistency of interpretation that frankly, MANY of us did not see at the state tournament this year compared to how calls were made during the season. If our officials can't listen to these concerns and consider a more consistent approach to these calls then they will never improve, which should be the goal of every official.

Well said, refdad. My kids are grown now, but I have three sons who wrestled in Missouri, Illinois, Kansas, Indiana, Ohio, Tennessee, Alabama, Georgia and Florida, in addition to Kentucky. Every one of the other states were more aggressive in calling stalling than Kentucky is. I agree with your assessment of that. On the other hand...you cannot call stalling one way for the first 10 weeks of the season and then radically change your philosophy for only the state tournament. Wrestlers deserve a consistent approach to stall calls, so they can adapt their style and strategy over the course of the season. It is unfair to ask them to suddenly change a wrestling style that helped them win their way to the state tournament in just a couple of matches.

There is no exact science to any seeding, however Tennessee and some other states do it. Although not 100% foolproof, Tennessee does "reward" state placers from the year before by separating them in the brackets with a simple formula. Most of the time you do not get quarterfinal matches that should be finals matches. In deep and balanced weight classes you will always have competitive semifinals, however at least it doesn't happen the first or second round in a seeded tournament.

If you want your wrestlers to go undefeated in 2009, don't sign up for this one. If you are in a rebuilding year with a lot of inexperienced underclassmen, don't sign up for this one. If you have some tough, mean seniors who don't mind taking some losses to nationally ranked studs...and later possibly compete for a state championship in Kentucky...head north to Easton. ...but take your trainer with you! LOL! :-D :-D :-D

Although Trinity has a very solid team, they should be content with the dual meet title. They don't have enough high placers to keep up with Union County at the individual state tournament. Union will lock this by the semifinals...unless the "leave it totally to chance" no-seeding format used in Kentucky has them with difficult quarterfinal matches all up and down the lineup. If, as expected, they come out of Region 1 with 10 or more champions, they will be tough to catch at state.

I'm just curious about the 215 bracket. How did Hester of Danville (25-7) end up unseeded and wrestling the #1 seed from John Hardin the first match?

What's up with Murton, Flake and Hasseltine? All ranked high but have not been wrestling. :? :?

Please post the video so we can watch this guy gasping for air and pleading for mercy!!! If I may suggest, start with a spladle, but let him up just before he passes out. Follow that up with a "midnight ride", but let him up just before he suffocates. Any other suggestions out there? PLEASE let us see the video!

Isaac Knable versus Brad Cooper :-o

So, how is "Fat Man" doing? For a big guy he was quick as a cat. His brother, Miguel, was a much better athlete.

Does anyone have complete results of the state duals? I can't find them posted anywhere.

Many of us who saw Kyle wrestle thought he was a legitimate D1 wrestler his senior year, when he placed high at the Beast of the East and Senior Nationals. The only real question we had was - would he get big enough and strong enough to wrestle at 125. Well, he has certainly answered that question. Anyone who saw him press Trejo (as a runt sophomore) would have known he is a tough, hard nosed kid..and technically as good as anyone who has come out of Kentucky in the past 10 years, in my opinion. I suspect he could be wrestling down a weight class this year, but wrestling at 141 will prep him for a run at a title the next three years. He is capable of being a D1 national champ as un upperclassman.

Why did Stacy Miller get DQ'd in the 3rd place match. Legit?

Shaun Cecil from Caldwell County.

OK, I'm predicting some upsets: 103 - Sullivan 112 - Luna 119 - Voth 125 - Scott 130 - Coleman 135 - Murton (MOW) 140 - Mines 145 - Banks 152 - Cooper 160 - Walls 171 - Zacur 189 - Starks 215 - Sherer Hvwt - Clark Western Kentucky shows better than previous years. Woodford County in a blowout - followed by Larue.

Too bad with Woodford there we couldn't have gotten stronger out of state teams. Would have liked to see Bradley Central or Baylor wrestling out of TN and maybe Mater Dei out of IN. Woodford will lose some individual matches with these teams, however I don't see a dual threat to them in this field. :shock:

Just a minor correction...the Booneville team is from Indiana. Tough kids. By the way...where was Caldwell last weekend? Thought they were going to the King of the Bluegrass.

What was this kid's record last year? Something like 60-0. And, Wayne wrestled out of state competition I believe from Tennessee, West Virginia and other states. Come on, let's give an undefeated state champ his due. I'm not sure he wrestled a single 6 minute match last year, even against out of state competition. Give him his due and let's be a bit proud of him as he represents Kentucky.