RATING OF OFFICIALS

[myGSP 4]

MI has a rating system for officials, all sports.

Should the KHSAA have something like this?

(http://www.mhsaa.com/LinkClick.aspx?fileticket=o7ofHiriog0%3d&tabid=152

page 5):

RATING OF OFFICIALS

[myGSP 4]

0 NO OPINION

Can someone fix that, please. :-D

[myGSP 4]

:-D

[DrCradle 0]

Indiana votes/eval, etc. officials.  List comes out in december.  Coaches(head coach only) places a point value 0-5.

To work a state finals MUST have a certain total.  this may have changed since I was involved.

[grappler-of-old 44]

I thought that Ky coaches already can rate officials. 

It is not mandatory but it can be done.  I don't think it should be mandatory but should be incouraged by coaches.  This can help our officials become better at what they do.

[myGSP 4]

I thought that Ky coaches already can rate officials. 

It is not mandatory but it can be done.  I don't think it should be mandatory but should be incouraged by coaches.  This can help our officials become better at what they do.

I think it would help the officials also and should be mandatory. If not mandatory then coaches will only rate them when something doesn't go their way or maybe a judgment call did go their way. They could also add notes as to how some officials don't get down on the mat to call pins, interpret the rules ect... (using wrestling as example) The head of officials could track what officials might be having a problem by looking at trends from a large pool of coaches throughout the year. They could be emailed in or a web site set up that coaches have to log into, officials have a assigned # and coaches rate them within 24/48hrs. of event. You could even have officials rate the events, field/mat/pool conditions, crowd control ect...

This should be for all sports, wouldn't be to hard to set up. Could bring up issues that are over looked now the are affecting sports. As Benjamin Franklin "An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure".

[d215 0]

i saw one official at jctc watching the officials and writing notes and when one coach ask what he was doing he said he was evaluating the other officials

[grappler-of-old 44]

I think it would help the officials also and should be mandatory. If not mandatory then coaches will only rate them when something doesn't go their way or maybe a judgment call did go their way. They could also add notes as to how some officials don't get down on the mat to call pins, interpret the rules ect... (using wrestling as example) The head of officials could track what officials might be having a problem by looking at trends from a large pool of coaches throughout the year. They could be emailed in or a web site set up that coaches have to log into, officials have a assigned # and coaches rate them within 24/48hrs. of event. You could even have officials rate the events, field/mat/pool conditions, crowd control ect...

This should be for all sports, wouldn't be to hard to set up. Could bring up issues that are over looked now the are affecting sports. As Benjamin Franklin "An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure".

And just what would happen if a coach did not give his opinion on officials every weekend?  We can't even get scores and tournament results on a KHSAA website and you think coaches would take the time to do this?  it would just give some school districts another reason to get rid of the sport at their school.  Especially if their coach is not submitting official ratings.

I'm not a fan of the mandatory thing.  Who cares if a coach only rates if the official makes a mistake.  If he is doing everything correct he does not need critiqued.

[DuckThat! 0]

Who would be the top 5 officials this year??

[myGSP 4]

And just what would happen if a coach did not give his opinion on officials every weekend?  We can't even get scores and tournament results on a KHSAA website and you think coaches would take the time to do this?

Football gets them,BB gets them, so a coach has to spend a couple more minutes, Wrestling Coaches have to do the optimal performance calculator for weight management online (if they did the Live Scorebook online you could get scores and tournament results not saying that they have to do this). Tell me a program that was dropped when this was added? If you make it part of their l responsibilities as a coach they will do it (any Coaches want to weigh in on this?)

it would just give some school districts another reason to get rid of the sport at their school.  Especially if their coach is not submitting official ratings. Tell me if you can a coach/program that was lost because of a rule change?

I'm not a fan of the mandatory thing.  OK, but as part of your job we all have mandatory things that we have to do.

Who cares if a coach only rates if the official makes a mistake.  If he is doing everything correct he does not need critiqued.

Because if that same official is getting a poor rating by several coaches it might ID a problem or if one coach gives a poor rating but others give a high rating there might not be a problem

How many times do you read things on this web site about how bad the Refs were? Add in all the other sports??? Any refs want to add thei thoughts?

[myGSP 4]

For those that haven't been to the optimal performance calculator site here is the link.

http://www.nwcaonline.com/NWCAOnline/Performance/Scholastic/Default.aspx

You can see it as a link on the KHSAA site at the top.

http://www.khsaa.org/wrestling/

[grappler-of-old 44]

Sorry I didn't actually say what I meant.  Sarcasm doesn't pass very well here.

The only non sarcasm in my post was the question.  What would happen if a coach does not rate officials?

I was trying to use the example of wrestling not using the live scorebook.  I'm not sure one exists for wrestling however.  Heck we can't get the coaches to send in the results to the local newspapers. 

I would be in favor of training officials.  Have clinics and weekly/monthly meetings.  have the rookie officials shadowed by experienced officials, maybe as a mat judge until they pass an internship or something. 

What we really need is more kids becoming officials.

[myGSP 4]

Sorry I didn't actually say what I meant.  Sarcasm doesn't pass very well here.

The only non sarcasm in my post was the question.  What would happen if a coach does not rate officials?

What happens if a coach doesn't do the optimal performance calculator? Or has his kids running with trash bags on to make weight and gets caught? Or drinks a few beers befor the finals and gets caught?

I was trying to use the example of wrestling not using the live scorebook.  I'm not sure one exists for wrestling however.  Heck we can't get the coaches to send in the results to the local newspapers. 

I would be in favor of training officials.  Have clinics and weekly/monthly meetings.  have the rookie officials shadowed by experienced officials, maybe as a mat judge until they pass an internship or something.

Agree, this would be great. But due to coast, I think this might be a better way 

What we really need is more kids becoming officials.

Could not agree more!

[grappler-of-old 44]

What happens if a coach doesn't do the optimal performance calculator? Or has his kids running with trash bags on to make weight and gets caught? Or drinks a few beers befor the finals and gets caught?

Don't use the performance calculator.  The kid is ineligable for post season.

As for the others there could be law suits and loss of job.

[grappler-of-old 44]

OK wait a minute.  MYGPS you have partially convinced me.  I will meet you part way on this.

It should be mandatory at the end of the year for coaches to rate officials.

After seeing officials several times throughout the year they could possibly be more constructive.

Having coaches rate after every dual or tourney, which would be twice a week for most.  Would be too time consuming.  They already have enough on their plate.

[myGSP 4]

Don't use the performance calculator.

Your ? was, What would happen if a coach does not rate officials? This is on the HS discussion so you only be talking about a HS coach wich have to use the optimal performance calculator. Are you a HS coach? If not you might need to learn the rules are for HS coaches, If you are a HS coach :-o :-o :-oThe kid is ineligable for post season.

As for the others there could be law suits and loss of job. And before you may get to them, you WOULD (no could about it)have to deal with the KHSAA

[myGSP 4]

OK wait a minute.  MYGPS you have partially convinced me.  I will meet you part way on this.

It should be mandatory at the end of the year for coaches to rate officials.

After seeing officials several times throughout the year they could possibly be more constructive.

Having coaches rate after every dual or tourney, which would be twice a week for most.  Would be too time consuming.  They already have enough on their plate.

I think a coach if he wanted to help the sport/had to (football,BB,wrestling ect...) could spend less than 3min. (which I think a normal report could be) within a 48hr. time limit.  Waiting till after the season means he/she would have to keep track of notes and such (less likely to get good info). If there is a problem in the beginning of the season it could be fixed, instead until having to wait until the end of the season.

[oldwrestler81 6]

Georgia does an interesting thing.  Their referees association gives every varsity ref. six assessment cards at the beginning of every year and the ref turns these over to six different coaches who rate him.  The referees association then uses that to determine who gets assigned to the state tournament.  The Ohio system is a bit more complicated but I'm sure refdad can explain it better than I can

[grappler-of-old 44]

Your ? was, What would happen if a coach does not rate officials? This is on the HS discussion so you only be talking about a HS coach wich have to use the optimal performance calculator. Are you a HS coach? If not you might need to learn the rules are for HS coaches, If you are a HS coach :-o :-o :-o

HuH???

Allow me to clarify my response.  If a head coach does not use the performance calculator for his wrestlers, then his wrestlers will be ineligible for the post season. This could happen in 2 ways. 1. The wrestler did not have his skin fold done in time or 2.  the coach does not keep up with the wrestlers weigh ins.  I'm quit certain that I could run circles around you on the rules of both coaches and wrestling.  :-o :-o

My true question to you was what would the KHSAA do to a coach if he did not rate an official. Do you really think they would punish the coach in any way?  Would they suspend him?  If so this could cause teams to fall (those small struggling teams that is)

[grappler-of-old 44]

I think a coach if he wanted to help the sport/had to (football,BB,wrestling ect...) could spend less than 3min. (which I think a normal report could be) within a 48hr. time limit.  Waiting till after the season means he/she would have to keep track of notes and such (less likely to get good info). If there is a problem in the beginning of the season it could be fixed, instead until having to wait until the end of the season.

Most coaches can keep track of an official over the year.  If they fill out a form quickly after a dual one of two things are likely to happen. 

1.  The coach still has a blurry vision of the official because of a bad call that may have cost his wrestler a match in his eyes.

2.  the coach quickly fills the card out an just gives the official random marks.  (Remember a good official is rarely noticed, so a coach may not remember if he even had a specific ref on his mat.

sorry for the late response i was being entertained by Anitra thread.  This is my last rebuttal on this.  You changed my opinion some and I tried to meet you half way.  and if you know me I rarely ever do this.  So I will stop trying to change your mind.

This is the opinion of GOO nothing more and nothing less

GOO out.

[myGSP 4]

HuH???

Allow me to clarify my response.  If a head coach does not use the performance calculator for his wrestlers, then his wrestlers will be ineligible for the post season. This could happen in 2 ways. 1. The wrestler did not have his skin fold done in time or 2.  the coach does not keep up with the wrestlers weigh ins.  I'm quit certain that I could run circles around you on the rules of both coaches and wrestling.  :-o :-o

My true question to you was what would the KHSAA do to a coach if he did not rate an official. Do you really think they would punish the coach in any way?  Would they suspend him?  If so this could cause teams to fall (those small struggling teams that is)

[myGSP 4]

Messed up the first time,

HuH???

Allow me to clarify my response.  If a head coach does not use the performance calculator for his wrestlers, then his wrestlers will be ineligible for the post season. If a head coach does not use the performance calculator for his wrestlers,  they are ineligible to wrestle in competition at all (regular or post). "Failure to determine an athlete

[myGSP 4]

Most coaches can keep track of an official over the year.  I just think it would be easier to spend 5min. after a match, than track throughout the year. Not my call when it would have to be done.

If they fill out a form quickly after a dual one of two things are likely to happen. 

1.  The coach still has a blurry vision of the official because of a bad call that may have cost his wrestler a match in his eyes.

2.  the coach quickly fills the card out an just gives the official random marks.  (Remember a good official is rarely noticed, so a coach may not remember if he even had a specific ref on his mat. Then how would he "Most coaches can keep track of an official over the year" your words

At dual matches if one coach rates bad and the other rates good, maybe a call to both coaches is needed. If both ratings are bad, then a call is needed. If numerous bad ratings are reported on a ref, something may have to be done. (what, is not my call)  At tournaments all coaches rate the officials covering the whole tournament. Agree, a good official is rarely noticed and the rating should reflect that. A not so good official will be noticed by the rating, instead of people complying about them on kentuckywrestling.com.

Not sure how it should be done, these are just some ideas. Would something like this help the officials become better, I would think so. With better officials comes better sporting events.

Anyone else have a opinion on this matter?

GOO, thanks for your thoughts. Even if they are only1/2 right. :-D

just kidding

[myGSP 4]

Any Coaches or Refs want to share your thoughts?  Think about improving HS wrestling, not beating up the refs. Yes a few need a beat down, maybe 2%.

[wrestling4life 0]

Wrestling officials in KY have started the KWOA, (Kentucky Wrestling Officials Association)

one of the many things they have done is create a wrestling officials rating sheet. I know at the beginning of the season they were being handed out at tournaments. If the coaches would fill these out at tournaments there could be more feed back. I know at one tournament with several teams and about 5 officials only 2 grade sheets where turned in