risingtide160 1 Report post Posted July 30, 2007 I felt the games werent ran very well this year very disorganized. I know i wrestled once, sat for about 5 hours then wrestled 3 matches back to back to back and this was just in one weight class i only had 1 match in my other class Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pioneer_pride 1 Report post Posted July 30, 2007 I felt the games werent ran very well this year very disorganized. I know i wrestled once, sat for about 5 hours then wrestled 3 matches back to back to back and this was just in one weight class i only had 1 match in my other class I hate to say it, but i agree with you. The frustrating part was the number of open mats throughout the day. It seemed like every time you looked up, there was 2 mats waiting for wrestlers to show up. This is the tournament director's problem but also the wrestler's problem. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
grappler-of-old 44 Report post Posted July 30, 2007 How many were at the games this year???? :? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pioneer_pride 1 Report post Posted July 30, 2007 the number i heard was 224. that's a great number for this late in the year if you ask me. it's a lot of work, to do it so THANK YOU Chris McCoy, Dan Upchurch, and everyone else who works to put this on!!! my only comments on how to possibly improve it would be to keep the mats going. maybe have a staging area next year...or something to make sure there wasn't empty mats so often. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pioneer_pride 1 Report post Posted July 30, 2007 I hate to say it, but i agree with you. The frustrating part was the number of open mats throughout the day. It seemed like every time you looked up, there was 2 mats waiting for wrestlers to show up. This is the tournament director's problem but also the wrestler's problem.I have to back pedal a bit on this one....i think it could have been better if there wasn't so many times that some mats were empty...but i don't know what was going on behind the scenes...maybe they were empty on some times because they were looking for wrestlers...maybe refs needed breaks..its hard to say. The other thing is...Chris McCoy has always been very generous to allow wrestlers to enter 2 brackets. I would guess that 90% or better of the wrestlers took advantage of this. That means that instead of having 224 kids, it was really like having 400+ kids. If you think of it from that perspective, it was actually a pretty fast tournament. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest wrestler92 Report post Posted July 30, 2007 I could be wrong, but there weren't 400+ wrestlers. I would say there were 224 entrants. But than looking at the brackets there were probably 8 classes that had only one person in it and 10 more that had only 2-3. The open division was pretty much just that, open...i think heavy was the only one that had 2 people in it. The problem that I saw was when there wasn't wrestling going on on a mat is we would get there when our name was called but the bout sheet had two different names on it. Also since it's not a khsaa matches I would say with the expception of if you are currrently wrestling on another mat you only have a minute to get to the mat to wrestle, no waiting five minutes for people to show up. One division that we waited on only had 4 kids in it, but it was the last one of the day to start and finish. The kid had two matches and they were both in the last 10 of the day. Imagine how late it would have been if it wasn't a contiuous 5 minutes on the matches and the clock actually stopped for out of bounds!!!!I have to back pedal a bit on this one....i think it could have been better if there wasn't so many times that some mats were empty...but i don't know what was going on behind the scenes...maybe they were empty on some times because they were looking for wrestlers...maybe refs needed breaks..its hard to say. The other thing is...Chris McCoy has always been very generous to allow wrestlers to enter 2 brackets. I would guess that 90% or better of the wrestlers took advantage of this. That means that instead of having 224 kids, it was really like having 400+ kids. If you think of it from that perspective, it was actually a pretty fast tournament. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pioneer_pride 1 Report post Posted July 30, 2007 I could be wrong, but there weren't 400+ wrestlers. I would say there were 224 entrants. But than looking at the brackets there were probably 8 classes that had only one person in it and 10 more that had only 2-3. The open division was pretty much just that, open...i think heavy was the only one that had 2 people in it. The problem that I saw was when there wasn't wrestling going on on a mat is we would get there when our name was called but the bout sheet had two different names on it. Also since it's not a khsaa matches I would say with the expception of if you are currrently wrestling on another mat you only have a minute to get to the mat to wrestle, no waiting five minutes for people to show up. One division that we waited on only had 4 kids in it, but it was the last one of the day to start and finish. The kid had two matches and they were both in the last 10 of the day. Imagine how late it would have been if it wasn't a contiuous 5 minutes on the matches and the clock actually stopped for out of bounds!!!!You're absolutely right, there weren't 400 entrants, but when you let people wrestle in multiple brackets....it ends up being the same number of bouts...that was my point. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
VisionQuest 64 Report post Posted July 30, 2007 The biggest problem IMO was wrestlers leaving or dropping out after losing their first match and not having the courtesy to inform them at the scorer's table. This resulted in many delays waiting on wrestlers. Thanks Coach McCoy, Coach Clark, Coach Upchurch, and the announcer(Sorry don't know this gentlemans name) for working all day without a break. If you took a break, I missed it. It must have been when I was on one of several I took. Thanks again.. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest wrestler92 Report post Posted July 30, 2007 I meant from looking at the bracket sheets there weren't 400+ entrants. And if there were, I think most of them were the little kids that got out of there early and were able to go home. I don't think the white mat stopped running for about 3 hours with two matches on it....that was a good thing too, almost would have been nice to use one of the larger mats and split it into 4 corners like they used to years ago. that would have rolled those through a lot quicker... but then you need more refs. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
el chico fiesta 0 Report post Posted July 31, 2007 Who won the 285 lb class? And how many showed up? Is it correct only 2 showed. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mathound 4 Report post Posted July 31, 2007 Any way you look at it, 224 people were there to wrestle in up to 2 divisions/weight classes and everyone got out of the building by 7:00PM. Even for the people living 3 hours away made it home before 11pm. I bet you that the people complaining here have A.) Never tried to run a wrestling tournament or B.) Is upset because you wrestled one match at 10am then 2 back to back at 4-5pm. or C.) They complain about every tournament (in which case they also fall under option A).If you are option B, I truly am sorry and apologize. Such things happen sometimes when you are running on paper with people in back to back weight classes and 200+ participants.How many times do you ever get out of the gym before 7PM at any given tournament? I'm also pretty sure that no one got paid for the state games, the refs, table workers, and directors were volunteering their own time to do this.Was it perfect? No. Is a tournament ever perfect? No.It should be mentioned that there were no "extra" referees. If you would like for the tournament to be quicker, then perhaps you should get qualified to referee and volunteer next year. (Or volunteer to help a table). The time for empty mats was mostly because of wrestlers not showing up on time or the very slight chance that a ref was needing to take a bathroom break.I'll go ahead and say what could have been done to make the tournament better to hopefully stop any further complaining:1. Tournament ran on computer (Sorry no resources were available. Not an option.)2. We had more referees volunteer.3. We made wrestlers report to a "pool" when on deck... if you didn't report before your match was called to wrestle its a forfeit (Also not an option as we didn't have enough people).4. Split the younger mat into 4 sections (see #2).5. I could have had a lunch break.Thanks to everyone that helped out, I think Chris and everyone that helped out did a great job with the tournament again. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mathound 4 Report post Posted July 31, 2007 I will also mention one more thing, 224 wrestlers is exactly how many a full 16 man bracket state tournament would be. Yes I know these were not full 16 man brackets (although about 4-8 of them were 12-14). I'd say about 80% of the wrestlers were in two weight classes. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
grappler-of-old 44 Report post Posted July 31, 2007 If you had 200 plus wrestlers and they were able to wrestle multiple wt. classes, and you got out at 7.PM?????I would stop complaining right there. How many tourneys do you attend during the high school season get out before 7PM????It's one of the things that is draging this sport down. I tip my hat to the Lafayette staff and all those that helped out if they accomplished this feat. Hopefully you are holding a tourney during the high school season. To many coaches try to hold a tourney without the correct help or knowledge of how to do so and they don't get the wrestlers and fans out of the tourney before midnight. GREAT JOB ON THE TOURNEY> :-D Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ˢʰᵃʷⁿ¹¹² 0 Report post Posted July 31, 2007 If you had 200 plus wrestlers and they were able to wrestle multiple wt. classes, and you got out at 7.PM?????I would stop complaining right there. How many tourneys do you attend during the high school season get out before 7PM????It's one of the things that is draging this sport down. I tip my hat to the Lafayette staff and all those that helped out if they accomplished this feat. Hopefully you are holding a tourney during the high school season. To many coaches try to hold a tourney without the correct help or knowledge of how to do so and they don't get the wrestlers and fans out of the tourney before midnight. GREAT JOB ON THE TOURNEY> :-Dyeah im with you, it was a pretty good toureny Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wrestling4life 0 Report post Posted July 31, 2007 Any way you look at it, 224 people were there to wrestle in up to 2 divisions/weight classes and everyone got out of the building by 7:00PM. Even for the people living 3 hours away made it home before 11pm. I bet you that the people complaining here have A.) Never tried to run a wrestling tournament or B.) Is upset because you wrestled one match at 10am then 2 back to back at 4-5pm. or C.) They complain about every tournament (in which case they also fall under option A).If you are option B, I truly am sorry and apologize. Such things happen sometimes when you are running on paper with people in back to back weight classes and 200+ participants.How many times do you ever get out of the gym before 7PM at any given tournament? I'm also pretty sure that no one got paid for the state games, the refs, table workers, and directors were volunteering their own time to do this.Was it perfect? No. Is a tournament ever perfect? No.It should be mentioned that there were no "extra" referees. If you would like for the tournament to be quicker, then perhaps you should get qualified to referee and volunteer next year. (Or volunteer to help a table). The time for empty mats was mostly because of wrestlers not showing up on time or the very slight chance that a ref was needing to take a bathroom break.I'll go ahead and say what could have been done to make the tournament better to hopefully stop any further complaining:1. Tournament ran on computer (Sorry no resources were available. Not an option.)2. We had more referees volunteer.3. We made wrestlers report to a "pool" when on deck... if you didn't report before your match was called to wrestle its a forfeit (Also not an option as we didn't have enough people).4. Split the younger mat into 4 sections (see #2).5. I could have had a lunch break.Thanks to everyone that helped out, I think Chris and everyone that helped out did a great job with the tournament again.Also the fact that 4 of the referees where also wrestling in the tournament is a reason you might have seen an open mat, but the biggest reason that I saw, and I was helping referee. Was the fact that people would leave, and would not let anyone know so we had to wait around on them. But I will say this, I am going on my 6th year as an official and I hardly ever get out of a gym by 7pm, unless it is a dual tournament. So if you are going to complain you should step up to the plate and volunteer next year to help out even more. Great job to all that worked!!!!! We are only making KY wrestling that much better. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Indians40 2 Report post Posted July 31, 2007 This is not criticism just a suggestion. You might consider next year having the kids 12 and under come in and start wrestling at 9:00 AM, then have everyone else start wrestling at 11:00 or 12:00. By that time the <12 should be complete and you will have more mat space and referrees for the older guys. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
eville dad 17 Report post Posted July 31, 2007 Good Idea splitting the age groups between morning and afternoon. Lots of tournaments are run that way and seems to work very well! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mathound 4 Report post Posted July 31, 2007 Good suggestion Indians40, I was talking about this at the tournament with one of the referees. I had said something like: the youth in at 9am, 11pm cadet/schoolboy, 2pm university/jr, 5pm Open. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pioneer_pride 1 Report post Posted July 31, 2007 Any way you look at it, 224 people were there to wrestle in up to 2 divisions/weight classes and everyone got out of the building by 7:00PM. Even for the people living 3 hours away made it home before 11pm. I bet you that the people complaining here have A.) Never tried to run a wrestling tournament or B.) Is upset because you wrestled one match at 10am then 2 back to back at 4-5pm. or C.) They complain about every tournament (in which case they also fall under option A).If you are option B, I truly am sorry and apologize. Such things happen sometimes when you are running on paper with people in back to back weight classes and 200+ participants.How many times do you ever get out of the gym before 7PM at any given tournament? I'm also pretty sure that no one got paid for the state games, the refs, table workers, and directors were volunteering their own time to do this.Was it perfect? No. Is a tournament ever perfect? No.It should be mentioned that there were no "extra" referees. If you would like for the tournament to be quicker, then perhaps you should get qualified to referee and volunteer next year. (Or volunteer to help a table). The time for empty mats was mostly because of wrestlers not showing up on time or the very slight chance that a ref was needing to take a bathroom break.I'll go ahead and say what could have been done to make the tournament better to hopefully stop any further complaining:1. Tournament ran on computer (Sorry no resources were available. Not an option.)2. We had more referees volunteer.3. We made wrestlers report to a "pool" when on deck... if you didn't report before your match was called to wrestle its a forfeit (Also not an option as we didn't have enough people).4. Split the younger mat into 4 sections (see #2).5. I could have had a lunch break.Thanks to everyone that helped out, I think Chris and everyone that helped out did a great job with the tournament again.Sorry for being critical above. :oops: :oops:It was a great tournament, it was just frustrated seeing the empty mats, but I spoke to coach McCoy about it and he educated me that it was mostly caused by wrestlers leaving the tourney and not showing up when called to the mat. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kdsmith27 14 Report post Posted August 1, 2007 Good suggestion Indians40, I was talking about this at the tournament with one of the referees. I had said something like: the youth in at 9am, 11pm cadet/schoolboy, 2pm university/jr, 5pm Open.One thing I like about the off season tournaments is that you do not have to wait the 45 minutes between matches. I'm sure this helped alot at the Bluegrass. Most tournaments in the off season only last till aproxiamately 3:00 to 5:00 pm. This is because of the no 45 minute rule and Speaking for KY we did not have the number of wrestlers that registered for the Bluegrass at any other KY tournament.. It would help alot during the regular season to reduce our tournament finish time dramatically if this rule was modified. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Danger 0 Report post Posted August 1, 2007 One thing I like about the off season tournaments is that you do not have to wait the 45 minutes between matches. I'm sure this helped alot at the Bluegrass. Most tournaments in the off season only last till aproxiamately 3:00 to 5:00 pm. This is because of the no 45 minute rule and Speaking for KY we did not have the number of wrestlers that registered for the Bluegrass at any other KY tournament.. It would help alot during the regular season to reduce our tournament finish time dramatically if this rule was modified. I like it too but sometimes it can be a little much. They called me to two mats at the same time. I went straight from one full match into another match. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mathound 4 Report post Posted August 1, 2007 We tried to keep this from happening as much as possible. Were you in two divisions or two weight classes? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
plee 0 Report post Posted August 1, 2007 I like it too but sometimes it can be a little much. They called me to two mats at the same time. I went straight from one full match into another match. I've always felt if you wrestle in 2 brackets, this is the risk you face. Yes, you could be called up back to back. One way that this might be avoided would be to have 2 sessions. This has been brought up on this thread already, but you could divide them up something like this:9AM session------------BantamNoviceCadetUniversity1pm session------------MidgetSchoolboyJuniorOpenThen only allow wrestlers to compete in 2 different age groups, not 2 weight classes in the same age division. That would avoid wrestlers being called up back to back because they entered 152, Cadet & Junior division. It would also probably help make sure wrestlers got adequate rest between matches without dragging out the tournament. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Danger 0 Report post Posted August 1, 2007 We tried to keep this from happening as much as possible. Were you in two divisions or two weight classes?Cadet 171 and Junior 171. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest DAWG6 Report post Posted August 1, 2007 I've always felt if you wrestle in 2 brackets, this is the risk you face. Yes, you could be called up back to back. One way that this might be avoided would be to have 2 sessions. This has been brought up on this thread already, but you could divide them up something like this:9AM session------------BantamNoviceCadetUniversity1pm session------------MidgetSchoolboyJuniorOpenThen only allow wrestlers to compete in 2 different age groups, not 2 weight classes in the same age division. That would avoid wrestlers being called up back to back because they entered 152, Cadet & Junior division. It would also probably help make sure wrestlers got adequate rest between matches without dragging out the tournament.This type of schedule has worked at the national level tournaments and will for local ones.You wrestlers all have to unders if you enter two weight classes or division you accept that risk of having back to back matches. Just an opinion Share this post Link to post Share on other sites