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Regions and States

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Do we have dates yet for middle school regions and states?

 

If not,  do we expect to go back to the old days of early February,  or keep it later like last year? 

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2 hours ago, BrisFan said:

Ive heard second weekend in March for State

That's surprising,  so it's after high school states now?  That's a long season since I believe middle school typically starts up before high school. 

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Originally it was discussed Sunday Feb. 27th for regions (would have to be Sunday due to HS conflicts) and the weekend of March 5-6 for state but those aren’t set in stone due to a venue not be reserved yet. It will depend on availability of a venue. It could get pushed back before HS regions/semi/state (early Feb). 

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Well last word I got was also Feb 27th and March 5th hopefully someone will get it all straight and let everyone know soon so we can make plans.  As for long season I agree we should start middle school first of Oct and end Thanksgiving weekend. That way kids that want to go straight into HS season can with no missed practice for other events or overlap. Then ones that one extra time on mat can find plenty of youth matches after Thanksgiving as well. No overlap for any of them. Just a thought to help out smaller programs that have to do all teams youth thru high school and not allowed to have other coaches. No other Middle School Sport goes on before the high school sport and ends after it just saying.

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10 minutes ago, panthers said:

As for long season I agree we should start middle school first of Oct and end Thanksgiving weekend. 

So you want to start when kids are playing fall sports and no other states around us are competing and end at Thanksgiving essentially cutting the season in half? Great idea. LOL

With the dates set(hopefully for at least a few years) starting middle school events after Thanksgiving wouldn't be a bad idea though.  Or just give kids more weekends off during the season.  

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Fall middle school sports end first Oct so it wont over lap. As for other states doesn't matter what they do some don't have it till Spring and that's ok too. Its not a fight just a suggestion. You will still have youth going on it Nov, Dec, Jan and etc... for anyone just said it wont interfere with anything high school is doing.

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46 minutes ago, panthers said:

Fall middle school sports end first Oct so it wont over lap. As for other states doesn't matter what they do some don't have it till Spring and that's ok too. Its not a fight just a suggestion. You will still have youth going on it Nov, Dec, Jan and etc... for anyone just said it wont interfere with anything high school is doing.

That is an interesting idea.  Not sure when fall middle school sports end.  If you can coincide the ending of middle school fall sports with the beginning of middle school wrestling that could work.  Those that are on the boarder of other states can still compete in those events it would just be after the Ky middle school post season.  

I can see this helping.  It would allow the middle school coaches to practice with the high school team with the middle school kids who still want to compete.  It also allows the middle school coach to help those new freshman now with the high school team.

I really se no negative to this, only positives. 8th grade kids can get an early taste of high school practice and go to high school events to either watch or participate.  

Panther I think you should work more closely with the middle school brass.  See it this is a possibility.  I really like this idea if it can work. 

Starting middle school before thanksgiving and ending in the middle of March is an extremely long and expensive season for middle school teams. 

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17 hours ago, panthers said:

Fall middle school sports end first Oct so it wont over lap. As for other states doesn't matter what they do some don't have it till Spring and that's ok too. Its not a fight just a suggestion. You will still have youth going on it Nov, Dec, Jan and etc... for anyone just said it wont interfere with anything high school is doing.

Maybe where you are at, but our middle school football teams are still playing.  

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20 minutes ago, GooglyMoogly said:

Maybe where you are at, but our middle school football teams are still playing.  

I agree some middle school teams still are playing in the state tourney that's not a part of the middle school season but still is a great thing for those programs. But dont we have the same issue with High School wrestlers still playing football in Oct and Nov when we are having High school practices. The Middle school State tourney finals I believe is Oct 16th and although this is late it still isn't that many kids it would affect. Nothing is a perfect plan just throwing this out to give a different thought for all to look at.

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16 minutes ago, panthers said:

I agree some middle school teams still are playing in the state tourney that's not a part of the middle school season but still is a great thing for those programs. But dont we have the same issue with High School wrestlers still playing football in Oct and Nov when we are having High school practices. The Middle school State tourney finals I believe is Oct 16th and although this is late it still isn't that many kids it would affect. Nothing is a perfect plan just throwing this out to give a different thought for all to look at.

The Middle School Football championship game is the second weekend in November.  The real solution would be to wait until December to start competing.  States with March Championships already do that and I imagine we will follow suit with our middle school schedule as well. 

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15 minutes ago, GooglyMoogly said:

The Middle School Football championship game is the second weekend in November.  The real solution would be to wait until December to start competing.  States with March Championships already do that and I imagine we will follow suit with our middle school schedule as well. 

I didn't realize  it went on that long but again its only a few teams it affects not all since it is a pay to play tourney. But regardless I know it is very important to those who do play. Either way its just an ideal to separate the high school and middle season. Which moving back to December to March wouldn't do but is better than what we have now. If not earlier I would be more in favor of a spring middle school season. Yes its different than some states but other states have much more support to grow the sport with more coaches to assist in the different level teams. Also I do believe there is a state or two that already has moved it to the spring. I could be wrong but heard talk of it.

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I would think that having states and regionals that late would cause a conflict in having some of those middle schoolers that compete in high school the day before for states.

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45 minutes ago, wrestling78 said:

I would think that having states and regionals that late would cause a conflict in having some of those middle schoolers that compete in high school the day before for states.

It absolutely does cause a conflict.  I've got multiple 8th graders that have worked for years for this opportunity to get on the podium in their last year of middle school, and now they risk limping into the season finale because they're also important point scorers for the high school team.  

I know it's already been voted on, but I'll just voice my opinion and say that it's a terrible idea to have middle school playoffs after high school.  We're looking at a long and grueling 5 month middle school season (mid-October to mid-March). 

I wasn't at the meeting where this was discussed.  Can someone explain why we've moved it to March? What's the reason to move middle school states back from the pre-COVID days?  What are we gaining, besides burnout and injuries? 

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32 minutes ago, gator1 said:

It absolutely does cause a conflict.  I've got multiple 8th graders that have worked for years for this opportunity to get on the podium in their last year of middle school, and now they risk limping into the season finale because they're also important point scorers for the high school team.  

I know it's already been voted on, but I'll just voice my opinion and say that it's a terrible idea to have middle school playoffs after high school.  We're looking at a long and grueling 5 month middle school season (mid-October to mid-March). 

I wasn't at the meeting where this was discussed.  Can someone explain why we've moved it to March? What's the reason to move middle school states back from the pre-COVID days?  What are we gaining, besides burnout and injuries? 

Opinion noted. Try being an optimist.

To answer your question: I think logistics was an important factor.

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21 hours ago, gator1 said:

It absolutely does cause a conflict.  I've got multiple 8th graders that have worked for years for this opportunity to get on the podium in their last year of middle school, and now they risk limping into the season finale because they're also important point scorers for the high school team.  

I know it's already been voted on, but I'll just voice my opinion and say that it's a terrible idea to have middle school playoffs after high school.  We're looking at a long and grueling 5 month middle school season (mid-October to mid-March). 

I wasn't at the meeting where this was discussed.  Can someone explain why we've moved it to March? What's the reason to move middle school states back from the pre-COVID days?  What are we gaining, besides burnout and injuries? 

As a coach who does youth through high school I voted for the move to March when it was first approved 3 years ago.  It blows my mind how most programs don't offer any offseason opportunities to your wrestlers then some come on here and argue for a 6-8 week season.  I want kids on the mat as much as I can get them.  We are surrounded on all sides by states better than us. A major reason is because they just wrestle more and we want to find ways to shorten things up.  Make it easier on coaches.  

I am not sure why they will be limping into the 'playoffs'?  If your 8th graders are good enough to wrestle enough matches during high school post season to get banged up I am sure they will be fine at middle school region/state.  If not they probably don't make it out of the region tournament and have a couple weekends off before they have to compete again.  YOU DON"T HAVE TO START THE WEEK AFTER FALL BREAK! KY is unique in that we are allowed to practice for 6 weeks before competing. I know IL(high school) gets 2 weeks and they are rolling. 

This move was first voted on and approved 3 years ago.  Venue issues are why we continued to have State the first weekend in February.  We voted again this year and it was approved again.  Less than 30 coaches were in the meeting and it seems those who are most involved want a longer season.  Weird... 

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34 minutes ago, GooglyMoogly said:

As a coach who does youth through high school I voted for the move to March when it was first approved 3 years ago.  It blows my mind how most programs don't offer any offseason opportunities to your wrestlers then some come on here and argue for a 6-8 week season.  I want kids on the mat as much as I can get them.  We are surrounded on all sides by states better than us. A major reason is because they just wrestle more and we want to find ways to shorten things up.  Make it easier on coaches.  

I am not sure why they will be limping into the 'playoffs'?  If your 8th graders are good enough to wrestle enough matches during high school post season to get banged up I am sure they will be fine at middle school region/state.  If not they probably don't make it out of the region tournament and have a couple weekends off before they have to compete again.  YOU DON"T HAVE TO START THE WEEK AFTER FALL BREAK! KY is unique in that we are allowed to practice for 6 weeks before competing. I know IL(high school) gets 2 weeks and they are rolling. 

This move was first voted on and approved 3 years ago.  Venue issues are why we continued to have State the first weekend in February.  We voted again this year and it was approved again.  Less than 30 coaches were in the meeting and it seems those who are most involved want a longer season.  Weird... 

The problem with the longer season is for smaller schools/programs that are sharing athletes. Even though I come from a program who's had some consistent mid level success, we've had very few wrestling only kids. Almost every kid, even the good ones, have played another sport (as well as coaches), and often wrestling has been their past time rather than their main sport. These are the kids that we will lose because of a longer season. I know that many of our kids will have moved on to spring sports, and the one's that stay won't have much left in the tank or great practice opportunities to stay sharp, as our teams (as well as many others) depend on our kids working out with the high school guys in the weeks prior to state and region. With the high school kids being gone, those opportunities will be gone as well.

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1 minute ago, rjs4470 said:

The problem with the longer season is for smaller schools/programs that are sharing athletes. Even though I come from a program who's had some consistent mid level success, we've had very few wrestling only kids. Almost every kid, even the good ones, have played another sport, and often wrestling has been their past time rather than their main sport. These are the kids that we will lose because of a longer season. I know that many of our kids will have moved on to spring sports, and the one's that stay won't have much left in the tank or great practice opportunities to stay sharp, as our teams (as well as many others) depend on our kids working out with the high school guys in the weeks prior to state and region. With the high school kids being gone, those opportunities will be gone as well.

Small school here as well.  Nearly all of our wrestlers play multiple sports so I am not sure why your kids will have moved on to spring sports. Ours don't until they are done.  Our kids that play fball don't quit when we start wrestling practices.  Why would it be different for spring sports? 

Again, why won't they have much left in the tank?  If an early February Championship is already maxing your kids out maybe you need to change a few things in your program.  

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Instead of being a pessimistic state full of excuses, it would be nice to have more optimism and find solutions.

So, given the situation we are in, and knowing no one can change it, what are you going to do? (Same question I asked myself last year during a pandemic)

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57 minutes ago, GooglyMoogly said:

As a coach who does youth through high school I voted for the move to March when it was first approved 3 years ago.  It blows my mind how most programs don't offer any offseason opportunities to your wrestlers then some come on here and argue for a 6-8 week season.  I want kids on the mat as much as I can get them.  We are surrounded on all sides by states better than us. A major reason is because they just wrestle more and we want to find ways to shorten things up.  Make it easier on coaches.  

I am not sure why they will be limping into the 'playoffs'?  If your 8th graders are good enough to wrestle enough matches during high school post season to get banged up I am sure they will be fine at middle school region/state.  If not they probably don't make it out of the region tournament and have a couple weekends off before they have to compete again.  YOU DON"T HAVE TO START THE WEEK AFTER FALL BREAK! KY is unique in that we are allowed to practice for 6 weeks before competing. I know IL(high school) gets 2 weeks and they are rolling. 

This move was first voted on and approved 3 years ago.  Venue issues are why we continued to have State the first weekend in February.  We voted again this year and it was approved again.  Less than 30 coaches were in the meeting and it seems those who are most involved want a longer season.  Weird... 

My reasoning for shorting the season is similar to RJS above but with a few differences. First off we are trying to build the sport in our community and it just isn't popular.  When it goes on forever and interrupts other sports or activities some of the newer kids although they may love it parents don't so we lose them. I am all in favor of any kid that wants more mat time to stay with the club since we have to be members anyways to do middle school and wrestle as long a season as they can and want in youth tourneys everywhere they can. Just the so called middle school season to be shorter. As for March ending I like it better than first of Feb because I don't have enough coaches to go to middle school state, girls state and high school event all on same weekend. As for spring and summer i want my kids as many as will or can to train off-season camps and tourneys. I just don't have many that will as a matter a fact I really wish we could get KHSAA to let us have Freestyle and Greco Spring Sport season so the state can improve overall as well. Maybe then I could get more kids to stay and do tourneys.

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2 minutes ago, panthers said:

I just don't have many that will as a matter a fact I really wish we could get KHSAA to let us have Freestyle and Greco Spring Sport season so the state can improve overall as well. Maybe then I could get more kids to stay and do tourneys.

Why does the KHSAA have to approve a spring FS&GR season for you to get kids to stay and wrestle? 

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10 minutes ago, GooglyMoogly said:

Why does the KHSAA have to approve a spring FS&GR season for you to get kids to stay and wrestle? 

So that it is a school sponsored event.  Then the school can hold practice, use buses and uniforms and pay for tournaments.  

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