Semi state

[halfhalfhalf 121]

9 minutes ago, panthers said:

Why 2 days that is a lot of over night for teams. 

$$

[BigBossMan 21]

Unless you have 2 gyms and 6+ mats going, 1 day tournament would be difficult to get through. Unless you do weigh ins and skin checks the day before, start wrestling at 7:00 a.m., no breaks, wrestle championship and consolation rounds at the same time and wrestle finals on all mats. Then you might be able to get it done by 12:00 midnight. 406-420 matches is a lot. Heckuva way to end a season. Sarcasm laid on thick --- "Let's take the championship tournament of the sport and make it the most grueling, least enjoyable experience for everyone participating and their fans, just so WE don't have to come back a second day!!" Guess who WE is?? I'm not referring to Panthers' comment either.  

For reference, middle school state was formerly held at Montgomery Co High School. 6 mats, 16 man brackets, wrestle back to 6th place. Wrestling would begin at 9:00 or earlier, no breaks unless required by time which is less than high school and finals would begin around 8:00. High school is more competitive, longer matches/periods and requires longer between matches. Ranger or Plantman can verify the timeline, but from what I can remember that's close. 

[grappler-of-old 44]

Hey I'm good with 2 days.  I just thought that was the reason for a 16 man bracket.  Thought KHSAA wanted to finish it in one day.

[plantmanky1 58]

16 hours ago, Ranger123 said:

I like it. Although I may not go totally 2 per weight. Maybe more of the NAIA idea of 12 total or a mix of the two. Maybe a team can enter up to X second wrestlers. I believe this would help with weight cutting as well. If I can be a backup to the state champ and wrestle a natural weight and still compete in the post season that may sound pretty good to some kids. 

Initially I don't think it matters to make a cut off on #2 guys, but as teams grow it could, and I understand why you say that, and like we used to say, "Let that be a good problem we have to deal with".   Now I could see this making JV regionals more of a bigger deal perhaps, and a podium spot there, gets your spot in District tournament or something along those lines.  

 

Only allowing 14 kids to wrestle for something in HS has always been a deterrent for kids whether anyone wants to acknowledge it or not, specifically your just average MS kids coming up.  Allowing 28 kids to participate at the end of the year, means many more teams with closer to full JV lineups all season.  That's a good problem to have.     

 

As to weight cutting, wasn't going to bring it up, but I agree, it helps with kids making hard cuts. 

 

 

[plantmanky1 58]

46 minutes ago, BigBossMan said:

Unless you have 2 gyms and 6+ mats going, 1 day tournament would be difficult to get through. Unless you do weigh ins and skin checks the day before, start wrestling at 7:00 a.m., no breaks, wrestle championship and consolation rounds at the same time and wrestle finals on all mats. Then you might be able to get it done by 12:00 midnight. 406-420 matches is a lot. Heckuva way to end a season. Sarcasm laid on thick --- "Let's take the championship tournament of the sport and make it the most grueling, least enjoyable experience for everyone participating and their fans, just so WE don't have to come back a second day!!" Guess who WE is?? I'm not referring to Panthers' comment either.  

For reference, middle school state was formerly held at Montgomery Co High School. 6 mats, 16 man brackets, wrestle back to 6th place. Wrestling would begin at 9:00 or earlier, no breaks unless required by time which is less than high school and finals would begin around 8:00. High school is more competitive, longer matches/periods and requires longer between matches. Ranger or Plantman can verify the timeline, but from what I can remember that's close. 

Spot on Bossman, practically slept in the MoCo gym for 2 nights.......kinda miss those days. 

[panthers 62]

21 minutes ago, plantmanky1 said:

Initially I don't think it matters to make a cut off on #2 guys, but as teams grow it could, and I understand why you say that, and like we used to say, "Let that be a good problem we have to deal with".   Now I could see this making JV regionals more of a bigger deal perhaps, and a podium spot there, gets your spot in District tournament or something along those lines.  

 

Only allowing 14 kids to wrestle for something in HS has always been a deterrent for kids whether anyone wants to acknowledge it or not, specifically your just average MS kids coming up.  Allowing 28 kids to participate at the end of the year, means many more teams with closer to full JV lineups all season.  That's a good problem to have.     

 

As to weight cutting, wasn't going to bring it up, but I agree, it helps with kids making hard cuts. 

 

 

I think its good either way with everyone 2 in each weight class or just a few. As for JV regionals or anything else JV that wont be good until we change what is and isn't JV as of now anyone is JV if they haven't made state. We should at least look at maybe making it only those varsity that have under 500 record or are a first year kid. I mean in some cases kids are ranked in the top 10 or in the state and going to JV. I for one don't see how that helps the true JV kids not varsity. 

[panthers 62]

1 hour ago, grappler-of-old said:

Hey I'm good with 2 days.  I just thought that was the reason for a 16 man bracket.  Thought KHSAA wanted to finish it in one day.

I don't care one day or two I was just like you and thought that was the reason for the 6th match approval.

[coachteater 70]

1 hour ago, panthers said:

I don't care one day or two I was just like you and thought that was the reason for the 6th match approval.

6 match rule was a national rule change, not just Kentucky.  

[Ranger123 43]

2 hours ago, plantmanky1 said:

Spot on Bossman, practically slept in the MoCo gym for 2 nights.......kinda miss those days. 

Yeah do kind of miss those days. They were a grind, but a lot of fun in the end. Coach Dettwiller and the Montgomery county crew were great hosts and we had some massive crowds for those events no matter how long they went or how bad the weather was. 

[bestmistake33 28]

I know for sure that Ohio and Indiana don’t, but does anyone know of any other state that hosts their state championship final in a high school gym?

 

Imagine saying that the Sweet 16 was being held in a high school gym or the football championship game was at a high school. 
 

Is rolling over and simply being thankful that we are even allowed to have a state wrestling championship tournament the right move?

 

Nothing will ever be the dungeon, the horse park was a step down even though it houses more, but heck we are now down to a high school gym!  What’s next, splitting mats in half with a piece of tape in the practice gym of the local high school so we can get done faster?

[grappler-of-old 44]

7 hours ago, plantmanky1 said:

Only allowing 14 kids to wrestle for something in HS has always been a deterrent for kids whether anyone wants to acknowledge it or not, specifically your just average MS kids coming up.  Allowing 28 kids to participate at the end of the year, means many more teams with closer to full JV lineups all season.  That's a good problem to have.     

Basketball only holds what 18 kids on the varsity squad? How many are on the cross country, golf, tennis teams in post season? 

As I mentioned before, I believe this would hurt the small teams (not necessarily small schools).  Imagine if Trinity or X could field two football teams.  It may help the overall number of wrestlers, but not the number of schools with wrestling.  You would definitely have to split into divisions if you allowed 2 per weight class. 

[coachteater 70]

5 hours ago, bestmistake33 said:

I know for sure that Ohio and Indiana don’t, but does anyone know of any other state that hosts their state championship final in a high school gym?

Just searching the interwebs while Im up past my bedtime, Ive found 10 others.

 

Montana Vermont Oregon Utah Nevada Rhode island Arizona New Hampshire Massachusetts Delaware 

[Ranger123 43]

16 hours ago, coachteater said:

Just searching the interwebs while Im up past my bedtime, Ive found 10 others.

 

Montana Vermont Oregon Utah Nevada Rhode island Arizona New Hampshire Massachusetts Delaware 

Not the list we want to be on wrestling-wise long term. I will say the GRC facility is extremely nice. But I agree for the future we need an upgrade to a larger venue. I am hopeful we can work with the KHSAA to make it happen. The changes put in place this off season show a drastically much improved willingness to listen to feedback from the coaches. 

[coachteater 70]

23 minutes ago, Ranger123 said:

Not the list we want to be on wrestling-wise long term. I will say the GRC facility is extremely nice. But I agree for the future we need an upgrade to a larger venue. I am hopeful we can work with the KHSAA to make it happen. The changes put in place this off season show a drastically much improved willingness to listen to feedback from the coaches. 

Totally agree.  Definitely need to be in a larger, nice venue. Kentucky just seems so different then many states when it comes to venues like we need. Seems to be dozens in every other state, but nothing here

[LCalum 31]

Rather than making statements like “a bunch of coaches want it” or “nobody really wants it”, start with a coaches poll and make the results public.   Let’s see what the state thinks.   Reach out to the head coaches for each team and get their opinion.   Then as a whole; argue for what’s best for the sport.  It’s easy to form an opinion for the majority when you’re talking to a portion.  

[halfhalfhalf 121]

1 hour ago, LCalum said:

Rather than making statements like “a bunch of coaches want it” or “nobody really wants it”, start with a coaches poll and make the results public.   Let’s see what the state thinks.   Reach out to the head coaches for each team and get their opinion.   Then as a whole; argue for what’s best for the sport.  It’s easy to form an opinion for the majority when you’re talking to a portion.  

lol. They took the coaches association vote, which was public for head coaches. If you go back to search for the thread you will see PLENTY of chatter over it. But I guess this dead horse isn't getting hit with a stick enough. It's a done deal and is not going to change. Time to move on, get ready for the fire works of the east/west semi-states and enjoy it! 

[grappler-of-old 44]

Do we know the locations of the two semi states yet?

 

[Ranger123 43]

31 minutes ago, grappler-of-old said:

Do we know the locations of the two semi states yet?

 

I thought you were hosting

[grappler-of-old 44]

don't you put that evil on me Rickey Bobby. 

Regional dual qualifier is what we have. 

[wrestleref 4]

I have a feeling that with the new alignment Semi State hosts won’t be revealed until Regional Tournament hosts are set. 

[coachteater 70]

11 hours ago, wrestleref said:

I have a feeling that with the new alignment Semi State hosts won’t be revealed until Regional Tournament hosts are set. 

Region 1- Caldwell Co

Region 2- Bardstown 

Region 3- Undecided 

Region 4- S. Oldham

Region 5- Simon Kenton

Region 6-  Bryan Station

 Region 7- Mccreary Cent. 

Region 8- Montgomery Co

[Forge2717 1]

On 9/29/2021 at 3:08 PM, coachteater said:

Khsaa should have new competition rules out by season start on the website, but its my understanding it will be like last year. The khsaa wanted to make sure that 32 kids still reached "state"  which semi state is part of. So points roll over and no semi state medals. Once again, thats my understanding,  I been wrong before. (Like twice , lol)

Will alternate’s return to ensure full brackets at Semi-state and State?

[DrBaker 497]

I think I speak for the parents, coaches, and fans that do NOT want 3 2 day tourneys. That’s a lot of driving, hotels, and leaving work early. 16 man tourneys can easily finish in 1 day with 4 mats. 

[grappler-of-old 44]

1 hour ago, DrBaker said:

I think I speak for the parents, coaches, and fans that do NOT want 3 2 day tourneys. That’s a lot of driving, hotels, and leaving work early. 16 man tourneys can easily finish in 1 day with 4 mats. 

I believe that is the plan with semi state. Can't speak for the regions, I believe that will be up to each region how they want to do it. 

State I believe will be 2 days. 

[grappler-of-old 44]

As for the state tournament. 

If you want a parade of champions and a stand alone finals you can't finish it in one day. 

Heck even back in the stone age when I wrestled a 16 man bracket at Atherton High School it was 2 days.