Takeaways from today’s State Duals Good and Bad

[Nike Man 292]

These are in no particular order other than how I typed them when they popped into my head.

1. Spencer Moore is gonna be a problem for a lot of kids for years to come! 

2. Coach Ruff and his wrestlers did a great job hosting once again. 

3. We have some great officials and we have some that need work. Some were a little out of their league today, but overall not bad. 

4. Rankings will change! Lots of great match ups. 

5. We have to find a way to seed this thing a little better, for the simple fact that some sectionals are just weaker. That’s not an insult, but a hard truth. 

6. McCracken Co., welcome to the party! For those of you with your head in a hole somewhere, Coach Nickal and his program are quickly becoming elite. They WILL WIN A STATE CHAMPIONSHIP IN THE NEXT 3-5 YEARS! You can bet on that. 

7. Is it time to possibly revisit the Big School/Small School debate again? Is it working? Is it beneficial?

8. The hospitality room should include bus drivers, just sayin. 

9. Should the State Duals rotate through our in state college wrestling programs for more exposure that would be beneficial for both sides?

10. And finally, congrats to St X and Union Co for doing what they do. Great programs and great Coaches. You both deserve to be called State Champs.

[wrastler_ 20]

4 minutes ago, Nike Man said:

These are in no particular order other than how I typed them when they popped into my head.

1. Spencer Moore is gonna be a problem for a lot of kids for years to come! 

2. Coach Ruff and his wrestlers did a great job hosting once again. 

3. We have some great officials and we have some that need work. Some were a little out of their league today, but overall not bad. 

4. Rankings will change! Lots of great match ups. 

5. We have to find a way to seed this thing a little better, for the simple fact that some sectionals are just weaker. That’s not an insult, but a hard truth. 

6. McCracken Co., welcome to the party! For those of you with your head in a hole somewhere, Coach Nickal and his program are quickly becoming elite. They WILL WIN A STATE CHAMPIONSHIP IN THE NEXT 3-5 YEARS! You can bet on that. 

7. Is it time to possibly revisit the Big School/Small School debate again? Is it working? Is it beneficial?

8. The hospitality room should include bus drivers, just sayin. 

9. Should the State Duals rotate through our in state college wrestling programs for more exposure that would be beneficial for both sides?

10. And finally, congrats to St X and Union Co for doing what they do. Great programs and great Coaches. You both deserve to be called State Champs.

Good Recap! Points 1&4

1.Is it just me or do others believe that Spencer might remain in the lineup he gave Hoppes a test and I very well believe Hoppes Places.

4. New #1 at 120 is it Preston Mattingly or Gabe Adams? Adams has win over Previous #1, Mattingly Running Through everyone Thus Far? Will be interesting to see 120 Play out at State.

[NO-OX 1 120]

Spencer Moore MOW!!!

[coachteater 70]

Whats your suggestions on seeding? This is seeding criteria coaches agreed upon within kywca. I'm  guessing you feel that teams that finished 2nd in their section should be able to be seeded in top 6? I can see both sides of it, but In the end, if you can't win your section, you don' t deserve higher seed than those who did

[Nike Man 292]

35 minutes ago, coachteater said:

Whats your suggestions on seeding? This is seeding criteria coaches agreed upon within kywca. I'm  guessing you feel that teams that finished 2nd in their section should be able to be seeded in top 6? I can see both sides of it, but In the end, if you can't win your section, you don' t deserve higher seed than those who did

Coach, first of all, just because it was agreed upon by the KYWCA committee doesn’t make it one of the Ten Commandments. It just means they made a decision and it should be looked at and possibly fixed for the future. Secondly, of course there are Section runner ups that deserve to be seeded above other Section winners. Your telling me that you can honestly and objectively look at the brackets today and say, “man we really did a great job of seeding the best of the best.” Cmon man, there were teams seeded that weren’t even filling full rosters. Not a knock on those teams, but you have to question the strength of the Sectional. And what are we doing including JV, yes people, JV dual records with our Varsity records to get our seeding criteria? Seems a bit odd. 

[Chris Duke 284]

14 hours ago, Nike Man said:

 

14 hours ago, Nike Man said:

 

14 hours ago, Nike Man said:

6. McCracken Co., welcome to the party! For those of you with your head in a hole somewhere, Coach Nickal and his program are quickly becoming elite. They WILL WIN A STATE CHAMPIONSHIP IN THE NEXT 3-5 YEARS! You can bet on that. 

I'll take this bet.  They are building a nice program no doubt about that.  My money is on Union until someone knocks them off.  In two years you better start worrying about the City of Union.  HOME OF THE RYLE RAIDERS!!!

 

Having trouble quoting on the site.  I'm not sure what is going on.

[naplesme 58]

Lots of positives on the day. A great day of wrestling. As for seeding: It's no different than a regular tournament were the best wrestlers are from the same Region. 

My one negative: Why were the weigh-ins done in the wrestling area in full view of the moms, dads, and others. It was inappropriate. They should have at least made an announcement to put away your cell phones. There were a number of parents and coaches upset about this.Last year the wrestlers weighed in, in the wrestling room. Why didn't they do this again?

[coachteater 70]

12 hours ago, Nike Man said:

Coach, first of all, just because it was agreed upon by the KYWCA committee doesn’t make it one of the Ten Commandments. It just means they made a decision and it should be looked at and possibly fixed for the future. Secondly, of course there are Section runner ups that deserve to be seeded above other Section winners. Your telling me that you can honestly and objectively look at the brackets today and say, “man we really did a great job of seeding the best of the best.” Cmon man, there were teams seeded that weren’t even filling full rosters. Not a knock on those teams, but you have to question the strength of the Sectional. And what are we doing including JV, yes people, JV dual records with our Varsity records to get our seeding criteria? Seems a bit odd. 

I believe with this format that it's a fair and good way to seed. Win your section, you've earned a seed. If you don't win your section then you have to wrestle you way into the top four, you still have the opportunity to get there. 

 

[REscalera 189]

Bacon is sizzling in Union county.

[REscalera 189]

19 hours ago, wrastler_ said:

4. New #1 at 120 is it Preston Mattingly or Gabe Adams? Adams has win over Previous #1, Mattingly Running Through everyone Thus Far? Will be interesting to see 120 Play out at State.

Mattingly has looked very tough and a favorite at 120.  When Deck went to 113 Wallace was put at 1 over Mattingly because of previous results i.e. defending state champ only lose is to Deck.  Can't argue against that reasoning either.  Not a knock against Mattingly just unfortunate for him  that Adams got a crack at Wallace first. I say because of the win Adams #1 Mattingly #2. 

[CUTiger184 59]

Great job by all teams that competed this weekend and thanks to LWC for hosting. Small school teams that wrestled for 5th-12th could have been out of there by 2pm. I do understand the following of the schedule but it would have been nice to keep things rolling. I suggested this last year. Taylor County and Campbellsville University now have facilities so that they can host Small or Big school while the other is at LWC. Switch sites for each division every year. Culminating event can be small school champ vs Big school champ and also swap that event year in and year out. I spoke with a Franky and he is on board, now I guess we present this at the the spring coaches meeting. Also I think we should wrestle a true 4th. And maybe give at large bids for teams so that we all get 5 matches, (if we do this it would cost us the small vs big champ match and the ability to wrestle for a true forth, that would be the draw back there. 

[LCalum 31]

9 minutes ago, CUTiger184 said:

Great job by all teams that competed this weekend and thanks to LWC for hosting. Small school teams that wrestled for 5th-12th could have been out of there by 2pm. I do understand the following of the schedule but it would have been nice to keep things rolling. I suggested this last year. Taylor County and Campbellsville University now have facilities so that they can host Small or Big school while the other is at LWC. Switch sites for each division every year. Culminating event can be small school champ vs Big school champ and also swap that event year in and year out. I spoke with a Franky and he is on board, now I guess we present this at the the spring coaches meeting. Also I think we should wrestle a true 4th. And maybe give at large bids for teams so that we all get 5 matches, (if we do this it would cost us the small vs big champ match and the ability to wrestle for a true forth, that would be the draw back there. 

I like being able to see the best teams big and small before regions and state tourney.   Just one random fan’s opinion. 

[CUTiger184 59]

What happened in the Wayne County vs Larue dual I saw 4 DQs and several team points take away from each team. 

[LCalum 31]

There was just one DQ that I’m aware of.  At 285 there was a heated match.  Emotions were high and one of the kids reacted poorly for what was his 2nd unsportsmanlike conduct of the match.  It happened as soon as the match was over and there was a discussion between the coaches and the refs.   My understanding is that the match should have stood as is, team points be taken, and the kid ejected.  Instead it was determined that the kid was disqualified resulting in the other kid winning the match.  Ultimately it didn’t change the outcome of the dual.  Outside of that one moment it was a hard fought dual on both sides as is always the case between these two teams.  

[ukpridewrestler11 276]

• 106 - Jon Gilbert (Madison Central) over Gage Fowler (Christian County) Fall 5:37
• 

 

#12 Ishmael Griffie (Christian County) over #8 WILL KEENEY (Madison Central) Maj 16-5

[mKay06 8]

45 minutes ago, ukpridewrestler11 said:

• 106 - Jon Gilbert (Madison Central) over Gage Fowler (Christian County) Fall 5:37
• 

 

#12 Ishmael Griffie (Christian County) over #8 WILL KEENEY (Madison Central) Maj 16-5

That is an error on trackwrestling. They were supposed to fix it Sat. It was actually Kinley over Fowler. Gilbert did not compete Sat.

[ukpridewrestler11 276]

31 minutes ago, mKay06 said:

That is an error on trackwrestling. They were supposed to fix it Sat. It was actually Kinley over Fowler. Gilbert did not compete Sat.

Makes sense. 

[thomam 11]

I'll go ahead and tell you all a couple teams gripes from our sectional. We never had one. It was supposed to be at Moore but was snowed out. Other teams immediately started talking about going to criteria. Trinity and Moore wanted the duals to happen as we both believed we could qualify. St. X was the clear #1. Central had the nod based upon dual meet record and no common opponents. 

Trinity offered to host on Friday January 19th. We had MLK day so weren't able to practice on that Monday. We then had Tuesday and Wednesday snowed out of school. Our County AD let us have optional practice that Wednesday for those who could make it. Thursday we had practice as normal. Upchurch instructed our section to have a vote to see who wanted to do Friday night at Trinity. It was voted down 4-2 with Moore and Trinity the only yes votes. St. X did not vote.

Moore, Central, Trinity and Male all had a chance to possibly qualify. Our other sectional schools don't fill too many weight classes. Upchurch also extended the deadline to the 24th to do our duals and other schools wanted no part. Just a bit unfair. 

I'm sure I'll get some flack for telling you all what went on but oh well. We wanted to compete and wanted to go to state duals. 
 

[CradleKY 132]

I have no tie to any team involved but I think it should be re-seeded.  Sectional champ doesn't mean much when some sectionals are so weak compared to other strong ones. Pick your top 4 teams and put them in diff pools.  That is a very easy task that shouldn't take more than 20 minutes to decide. Then pick your next 4 and place them in appropriate pools making sure to separate teams from same sectional.  After that blind draw in the rest of the teams. Seems most fair and the semis will be worth watching instead of a team winning a dual 51-12.  Giving a team an easier path because of where they are located geographically in the state (how Sectionals are determined) instead of based on performance and resume is a tough thing to defend but I guess that's what the coaches prefer for now.

 

 

[tja 150]

I need more elaborate insight on how little Spencer Moore did ? Kid is a monster..

[ukpridewrestler11 276]

9 minutes ago, tja said:

I need more elaborate insight on how little Spencer Moore did ? Kid is a monster..

• 113 - 8th Spencer Moore (Walton Verona) over Unknown (Unattached) Forf

• 113 - 8th Spencer Moore (Walton Verona) over 8th Gavin Papajeski (Trigg County) Fall 1:51

• 113 - Fr. Thomas Hoppes (La Rue County) over 8th Spencer Moore (Walton Verona) Dec 8-3

• 113 - 7th Glenn Mayes (Union County) over 8th Spencer Moore (Walton Verona) Dec 2-0

At dang near 30 pounds below the 113 weight class, he held his own. Hoppes is ranked 5th at 113. Definitely going to make some noise when he puts on a few more extra lbs. 

 

[CradleKY 132]

thats pretty impressive. 

[PABacon 45]

On 1/29/2018 at 8:42 PM, CUTiger184 said:

Great job by all teams that competed this weekend and thanks to LWC for hosting. Small school teams that wrestled for 5th-12th could have been out of there by 2pm. I do understand the following of the schedule but it would have been nice to keep things rolling. I suggested this last year. Taylor County and Campbellsville University now have facilities so that they can host Small or Big school while the other is at LWC. Switch sites for each division every year. Culminating event can be small school champ vs Big school champ and also swap that event year in and year out. I spoke with a Franky and he is on board, now I guess we present this at the the spring coaches meeting. Also I think we should wrestle a true 4th. And maybe give at large bids for teams so that we all get 5 matches, (if we do this it would cost us the small vs big champ match and the ability to wrestle for a true forth, that would be the draw back there. 

Just my opinion but this would stink. State duels in other states lasts 2 days so I'm not worried about 1 day going past 2:00. I guess for the losing teams you might think hindsight you wish you could have got out of there earlier but  to me the most exciting part of the whole day is the challenge between the two champs Big vs Small! Take that match away and honestly it could seem like a dull quick meaningless day even for the champs. It's supposed to be a championship, not a race home.  Just sayin.

[CUTiger184 59]

5 hours ago, PABacon said:

Just my opinion but this would stink. State duels in other states lasts 2 days so I'm not worried about 1 day going past 2:00. I guess for the losing teams you might think hindsight you wish you could have got out of there earlier but  to me the most exciting part of the whole day is the challenge between the two champs Big vs Small! Take that match away and honestly it could seem like a dull quick meaningless day even for the champs. It's supposed to be a championship, not a race home.  Just sayin.

I agree, its definitely not a race home,  I'm just relaying feedback from what I heard from coaches and parents.I'm all for the Big vs Small challenge, I think if we split it into two relatively close locations and swap the BIG vs. SMALL dual it would be a great environment for the kids.  I wrestled under the spotlight in front of lots of fans at LWC and CU and I think Coach Ruff and Coach James would provide an excellent and unique environment for the culminating event (Big vs. Small).    Also the challenge is an option not a requirement. However, I'm in favor of a 16 team format and a two day event, which would maximize matches for teams each day.  Also in terms of exposure and recruiting we could even consider swapping the event around the various wrestling colleges in the state if we keep it as one event.  CU, LWC, Bellarmine, UofC, Thomas More, and KY Wesleyan I think would all love the exposure.  

[ukpridewrestler11 276]

1 hour ago, CUTiger184 said:

I agree, its definitely not a race home,  I'm just relaying feedback from what I heard from coaches and parents.I'm all for the Big vs Small challenge, I think if we split it into two relatively close locations and swap the BIG vs. SMALL dual it would be a great environment for the kids.  I wrestled under the spotlight in front of lots of fans at LWC and CU and I think Coach Ruff and Coach James would provide an excellent and unique environment for the culminating event (Big vs. Small).    Also the challenge is an option not a requirement. However, I'm in favor of a 16 team format and a two day event, which would maximize matches for teams each day.  Also in terms of exposure and recruiting we could even consider swapping the event around the various wrestling colleges in the state if we keep it as one event.  CU, LWC, Bellarmine, UofC, Thomas More, and KY Wesleyan I think would all love the exposure.  

This