Chris Duke

Middle School and Youth State

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On 1/17/2018 at 5:42 AM, Chris Duke said:

Yes,  Dutch I brought it up only because I didn't see the rule change.  When it was top 4 I didn't agree with it but it seemed like a good compromise.  Two years later it's placers.  Now if you qualify, REALLY just qualifying will eliminate a kid from wrestling with kids his age.  I'm just not sure how this promotes growth.  

When you watch kids bust their tails all year and they have to choose between Youth and Middle School I doesn't make sense to me.  We have 2 kids that will not compete in the Middle School tournament and wrestle in a watered down Youth State because of this.  Both kids would most likely go 1-2 or maybe 2-2 in the Middle School Tournament.  How are we growing by making these kids choose?  By making teams and parents choose we are watering down both tournaments.  

I completely agree. If growth is what we're looking for, then the experience of wrestling in Middle School State against the top kids in that weight class gives our young men and women the opportunity to grow. I think placing top 4 is a good cutoff for youth. My older son placed 6th in his 8th grade year at Middle School State, then went on to place 2nd at youth the next day. The entire weekend was an outstanding experience for him and his younger brother, who also placed 2nd at youth that year. The time they both got on the mat, against top competition, was invaluable to their growth, both as wrestlers and their character. 

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On 1/17/2018 at 11:48 PM, Nike Man said:

If people don’t like grade requirements, maybe we should go to USA age requirements. Wrestle your age division and that’s all. Too many options for parents and coaches. Make age, grade, and weight definitive. No percents on weight. Make a weight class. But that’s a whole other ball of wax.

Are you kidding me USA wrestling has already shanghaid our middle school programs.  You want to give them total control?  

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It already costs a small fortune for middle school teams to get USA cards for all their wrestlers then another to enter the regional tourny. All for insurance that school teams do not need.  The poor and inner city teams can barely afford it now.  When their teams get larger it makes it almost impossible. 

 

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On 1/19/2018 at 3:58 PM, Stall Camp said:

Have the coaches had the Regional seed meeting yet? 

I’ve heard that it was being pushed back now to after the State Duals. Don’t quite understand why this also has changed but I’m sure there’s a vote out there somewhere we didn’t attend. I enjoyed the days when we’d get on right after the Regionals and battle who’s #1 out of each regional winner and then move up the weight classes. Now watch some teams forego the MS duals because of other teams going or not going. 

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22 minutes ago, gameface said:

I’ve heard that it was being pushed back now to after the State Duals. Don’t quite understand why this also has changed but I’m sure there’s a vote out there somewhere we didn’t attend. I enjoyed the days when we’d get on right after the Regionals and battle who’s #1 out of each regional winner and then move up the weight classes. Now watch some teams forego the MS duals because of other teams going or not going. 

I’m all up for MS duals if we did it like high school does. Split Club and School teams and do it mid to late December in the heart of the season. Not knowing if you “qualify” or not makes it hard on teams to keep their kids and parents interested. Especially the ones that didn’t qualify for Middle School State. Also doing it the same weekend as high school doesn’t help the cause when you lose 3 of your kids to the high school team for their state duals. It would entice more teams to come. I guarantee that. Only stipulation would be you would have to have at least 10 spots filled on your team to come. 12 School teams and 12 club teams. 

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I agree. State duals should be held mid season. Why risk injury or your State seed the weekend before The Big Show. I cannot imagine any coaches would risk the head to head battle of their number 1 seeds. Plus, several number 1's won't even wrestle ms. They will be with their H.S. team. For that reason alone this tournament proves very little.

 

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14 hours ago, gameface said:

I’ve heard that it was being pushed back now to after the State Duals. Don’t quite understand why this also has changed but I’m sure there’s a vote out there somewhere we didn’t attend. I enjoyed the days when we’d get on right after the Regionals and battle who’s #1 out of each regional winner and then move up the weight classes. Now watch some teams forego the MS duals because of other teams going or not going. 

They feel that head to head at state duals may change seeds! Most state placers will not be wrestling duals for cautionary reasons..

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1 hour ago, Bulldoglife said:

They feel that head to head at state duals may change seeds! Most state placers will not be wrestling duals for cautionary reasons..

All I read about is the need for growth in Kentucky, improving against good competition and trying to wrestle more against good competition,  and now coaches are holding kids out for a chance against stronger competition.  That is kind of sad.

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1 minute ago, DocG said:

All I read about is the need for growth in Kentucky, improving against good competition and trying to wrestle more against good competition,  and now coaches are holding kids out for a chance against stronger competition.  That is kind of sad.

I agree 100% Doc!

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55 minutes ago, DocG said:

All I read about is the need for growth in Kentucky, improving against good competition and trying to wrestle more against good competition,  and now coaches are holding kids out for a chance against stronger competition.  That is kind of sad.

There will be strategy at State Duals.  That is a fact.  We will put our best kids on the mat to give us the best chance of winning.  What we will not do in that process is affect their seed for the State Tournament.  Our team will not show up just to say we went!  We are in it to win it.  State Duals are fun, but the bigger picture is winning the overall title the following week.   All wrestlers are not created equal!!!  Some kids need our help to get them in the best position to win.

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14 minutes ago, Chris Duke said:

There will be strategy at State Duals.  That is a fact.  We will put our best kids on the mat to give us the best chance of winning.  What we will not do in that process is affect their seed for the State Tournament.  Our team will not show up just to say we went!  We are in it to win it.  State Duals are fun, but the bigger picture is winning the overall title the following week.   All wrestlers are not created equal!!!  Some kids need our help to get them in the best position to win.

I do understand what your saying but here’s what I say...let em wrestle. 

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1 minute ago, Bluesdad said:

I do understand what your saying but here’s what I say...let em wrestle. 

If your son was my wrestler I would also say let them wrestle.  It's easy to say when your on top!

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1 hour ago, DocG said:

All I read about is the need for growth in Kentucky, improving against good competition and trying to wrestle more against good competition,  and now coaches are holding kids out for a chance against stronger competition.  That is kind of sad.

 

31 minutes ago, Chris Duke said:

There will be strategy at State Duals.  That is a fact.  We will put our best kids on the mat to give us the best chance of winning.  What we will not do in that process is affect their seed for the State Tournament.  Our team will not show up just to say we went!  We are in it to win it.  State Duals are fun, but the bigger picture is winning the overall title the following week.   All wrestlers are not created equal!!!  Some kids need our help to get them in the best position to win.

I do agree partly. The point of state duals is to show team ability and sportsmanship,however we had a kid get his leg broke in December from a bad fall on the mat. That being said if you have a kid who is in serious contention for a top finish at state tournament where it is about the individual I personally wouldn't want to take the chance of risking their chances. That is why we lay it all out to our contenders and let them decide. Just say you have a wrestler that is 8th grade been to state every year and barely places but now he has a chance at top 2, why take a chance at him not being able to achieve what he has worked for? Although we are teams we are still an individual sport. 

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1 hour ago, DocG said:

All I read about is the need for growth in Kentucky, improving against good competition and trying to wrestle more against good competition,  and now coaches are holding kids out for a chance against stronger competition.  That is kind of sad.

I agree with DocG. Just not the weekend before State. Too many risks involved this late in the game.

Injuries or skin funk.

No thanks.

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30 minutes ago, Braves coach said:

I agree with DocG. Just not the weekend before State. Too many risks involved this late in the game.

Injuries or skin funk.

No thanks.

Braves coach, that's the point why risk a kids chances that close to the big dance? 3 years ago we had an 8th grader from Campbell county who should have taken 1st but got eliminated at weigh ins with ring worm. This is a meet that needs a new date like a week after State.That way all your top kids are not at risk and the rest are at top form.

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Mid Season and we get all teams at full strength with no dodging of competition. Also allows us the chance to see teams from all 4 corners of the state before the state tournament. And maybe get to actually wrestle against them or have a common opponent at least for the seeding of the state tournament.

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10 minutes ago, twenhofelcoach said:

Mid Season and we get all teams at full strength with no dodging of competition. Also allows us the chance to see teams from all 4 corners of the state before the state tournament. And maybe get to actually wrestle against them or have a common opponent at least for the seeding of the state tournament.

Wow Keith that was some fancy thinking for you. I am impressed.

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31 minutes ago, twenhofelcoach said:

Mid Season and we get all teams at full strength with no dodging of competition. Also allows us the chance to see teams from all 4 corners of the state before the state tournament. And maybe get to actually wrestle against them or have a common opponent at least for the seeding of the state tournament.

It's a great plan.  The only drawback would be how to sort out which teams would go.

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 That’s the easy part, each region gets 4 club teams and 4 school teams invited. You must be able to fill 10 weights of the 15 available. If regions can’t get enough schools to commit, then it’s open invite after that.

15 minutes ago, rjs4470 said:

It's a great plan.  The only drawback would be how to sort out which teams would go.

 

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9 minutes ago, twenhofelcoach said:

 That’s the easy part, each region gets 4 club teams and 4 school teams invited. You must be able to fill 10 weights of the 15 available. If regions can’t get enough schools to commit, then it’s open invite after that.

 

Great plan. Good luck getting it done with this board.  Until then we are going to have a nice jv Ms state duals. Woo hoo..

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1 hour ago, Bulldoglife said:

Wow Keith that was some fancy thinking for you. I am impressed.

He’s on the ball today!! Rump is not going to be the butt of any jokes today so back it down Holmes!

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2 minutes ago, gameface said:

He’s on the ball today!! Rump is not going to be the butt of any jokes today so back it down Holmes!

Never you know me better thaN THAT. 

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